Breeding Difficulties

[jeffb]

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talking up in scotland, the subject got around to breeding what to use and availability of sires to use. Talking to people i didn,t realise the amount of top race dogs that that would make great sires that are born without testicles,there is certainly a problem in our sport, and if its not sorted out it could kill the breeding side off hence have a great effect on the racing side. There is certain pedigrees that this affects more than others .

. When a new sire comes on the scene and starts throwing good race .dogs every bitch in the country tends to go to it. over the years its been from BILKO thenGOOD as GOLD. in recent years its been WOR JOHN and JUST FRIENDS .these are all legends in our breeding programmes and i applaud andy for retir.ing hes dog from the breeding paddocks hes seen the need for new blood to be giving the chance if not we are going to have a major problem in our sport. So whats peoples ideas use more new blood example greyhound or limit amount of litters a stud dog can register each year making use different sire only suggestions

 

[mutley]

greyhound blood to break up the gene pool jeff new blood or take a chance on a dog that hasnt won much after all there all well bred

 

[gary farmer]

IM AFRAID ITS ONLY GOING TO GET WORSE

I SAID THIS IN ONE OF THE OTHER TOPICS

THE MORE BREEDING RESTRICTIONS BOUGHT IN THE SMALLER THE GENE POOL WILL GET

WE ARE GETTING MORE PUPS WITH DEFECTS AND MORE BITCHES HAVING C SECTIONS AND MORE PUPS STILL BORN

THATS WHY I ALLWAYS USE GREYHOUNDS HAVENT LOST A PUP FROM A GREYHOUND YET

NEW BLOOD

DOES NOT MATTER WHAT WHIPPET YOU PUT TO A GREYHOUND YOU CANT INTERBREED

GARY

 

[rodders]

Testical issue is in greyhounds aswell as whippets

 

[wild whippies]

I agree that greyhounds have the widest gene pool, I know this to be fact. BUT, they are not without fault and one such potentially devastating fault is the bone abnormalities rearing their head in some lines of greyhound that is currently being investigated. (According to a GBGB greyhound trainer)

One should note such faults when introduced to a smaller gene pool will be magnified dramatically.

Jeff it depends what people mean by born without testicles. The vast majority of the time it is cryptorchdisim and the testicles are present, just not in the right place. Either way, the KC sees such abnormalities as a fault within the breed and breeding from such is strongly deterred.

The abnormality STILL occurs.

As such those that are cryptorchid, I do not personally cast aside as having a fault.

Obviously those that are genuine Anorchids (born without testicles) eliminate themselves from the gene pool.

With regards to Just Friends, I'll say what I said to Andy. I appreciate what he's doing but my concern is that the dog will be replaced by a dog carrying a fault.

There are dogs carrying faults, they've been used regardless.

There are sound dogs who have proven themselves over their whole racing career, not just for speed but durability as well, yet have been denied the opportunity of a stud career through plain ignorance.

I don't think limiting a stud dogs career is the answer.

I don't think outcrossing to a greyhound at every opportunity is the answer either except in the case where a non-ped has a fault that needs to be elliminated and the greyhound concerned is capable of elliminating that fault.

I think people doing their homework by looking at pedigrees, looking at what is getting injured as well as what's winning and actually taking a risk on using a certain stud is beneficial.

If things carried on regardless, so long as people breed diverse there is little opportunity for genetic faults to occur.

Chinooks originated their breeding back to only 11 remaining dogs. Because the dogs had varied appearances with emphasis being on working ability, not appearance, the breed was able to re-establish it's numbers. Now it has been given Kennel Club recognition and appearance dictated by a standard and a pure bred 4 generation pedigree, faults and defects are raising their heads.

Breed clones and you breed defects. The ''standard'' for the non-ped is for it to be ''whippet like'' in appearance. So long as this ''standard'' is kept wide open, there will be little chance for a defect to occur.

I would suggest the answer is for people to do what they think is right for their breeding.

 

[gary farmer]

Testical issue is in greyhounds aswell as whippets

HI Karen

thats true but nowhere near the persentage we have in the non peds

and i dont get half the problems mating to greyhounds that we get with the non peds

gary

 

[rodders]

Testical issue is in greyhounds aswell as whippets

HI Karen

thats true but nowhere near the persentage we have in the non peds

and i dont get half the problems mating to greyhounds that we get with the non peds

gary

You don't have to convince me Gary.I prefer a straight half cross :thumbsup: but then again I do like big uns (w00t) :lol:

 

[jeffb]

i didnt bring this up to push the greyhound side of breedingi was more wondering about breeders using different whippet stud dogs to extend the gene pool like north to south,maid your point,avit,hellbound,other dogs coming to the for like classic rock,boybelle,blue reflections and many other young dogs variations but people dont like to take a chance..

 

[rodders]

i didnt bring this up to push the greyhound side of breedingi was more wondering about breeders using different whippet stud dogs to extend the gene pool like north to south,maid your point,avit,hellbound,other dogs coming to the for like classic rock,boybelle,blue reflections and many other young dogs variations but people dont like to take a chance..

It's about time you put your lad up for stud to extend the gene pool :thumbsup:

 

[mutley]

all dogs are well bred now taking a chance aint such a risk anymore

 

[Trojan]

Totally agree Gary, breeding a gamble no matter what you go to and like you say all well bred now :thumbsup:

 

[wild whippies]

i didnt bring this up to push the greyhound side of breedingi was more wondering about breeders using different whippet stud dogs to extend the gene pool like north to south,maid your point,avit,hellbound,other dogs coming to the for like classic rock,boybelle,blue reflections and many other young dogs variations but people dont like to take a chance..

It's about time you put your lad up for stud to extend the gene pool :thumbsup:

I agree! What should we do Jeff? Go halvers on some advertising or a brood bitch for our virgins?!! (w00t)

 

[gary farmer]

i didnt bring this up to push the greyhound side of breedingi was more wondering about breeders using different whippet stud dogs to extend the gene pool like north to south,maid your point,avit,hellbound,other dogs coming to the for like classic rock,boybelle,blue reflections and many other young dogs variations but people dont like to take a chance..

not trying to push the greyhounds just stating a fact

and the dogs you mentioned most of them have been used for stud lol

gary

 

[Vicky]

talking up in scotland, the subject got around to breeding what to use and availability of sires to use. Talking to people i didn,t realise the amount of top race dogs that that would make great sires that are born without testicles,there is certainly a problem in our sport, and if its not sorted out it could kill the breeding side off hence have a great effect on the racing side. There is certain pedigrees that this affects more than others .. When a new sire comes on the scene and starts throwing good race .dogs every bitch in the country tends to go to it. over the years its been from BILKO thenGOOD as GOLD. in recent years its been WOR JOHN and JUST FRIENDS .these are all legends in our breeding programmes and i applaud andy for retir.ing hes dog from the breeding paddocks hes seen the need for new blood to be giving the chance if not we are going to have a major problem in our sport. So whats peoples ideas use more new blood example greyhound or limit amount of litters a stud dog can register each year making use different sire only suggestions

I've banged on about using different stud dogs til the cows come home but the top & bottom of it is, there just isn't that good an amount of dogs out there and people don't like taking a risk for some reason.

I agree with Gary Bailey that they're all well bred but when it comes to narrowing your list down with;

Was the sire fast?

Do i want an early paced dog or one that can stay a bit?

Is the sire likely to thow bully to my already stocky bitch?

Is he the weight i want, will he throw big/small?

Was the rest of his litter good?

Was he a dog that raced as a veteran without any lengthy layoffs (a major plus point for me would be if he could still compete with adults as a veteran)

(and for some people) Is the dog within a reasonable travelling distance?

Is it known whether the dog passes on any faults ie toe problems?

You really don't have that much to choose from.

With regards to putting your dog at stud (and if you're not in it for the money) you then have the aggravation of messing about trying to get maiden bitches lined, people bringing bitches that aren't ready/going out, being messed about with people booking your dog and then using something else and more importantly worrying about where the pups are going to end up.

Breed for yourself rather than relying on other people to do the right thing by the breed, I am of the opinion to breed WHAT I WANT and use my dog over bitches I WANT and if he never got another bitch it wouldn't bother me in the slightest, as far as i'm concerned we've got a bitch from him that in our eyes is perfect and will hopefully continue his line.

Breeding should in my eyes be something you do once in a blue moon and do it properly, hearing horror stories of the state in which some people have received young pups makes my blood boil and whilst i know accidents do happen, when you look at the % of broken bones in some litters you see that the bad rearing has shown.

 

[whippeteerThe1st]

i agree with u vicky,,,,dogs that have stood test off time :thumbsup:

on scottish 10days i was racing vet,,,,,showman was still running well ,,,,i raced against branco ,bitch and indica bitch and my own geordies worst night mare

i showed tony who was doing traps at end the time indica did in my race, with gwn,,,,off 8.32,,but both dogs ran - 1yard and -2yards,,,gwn got beat 1yard,,,,meaning indica 26lb and gwn 27lb mark were running under 8.30,s for a 5 year old and 6 yearold thats faster than most adults in there weight group

and branco and showman ,,,if in adults would have kicked ass with younger dogs as well,,,,the veterans were unbelivble this year,,,,lucky for some they werent entered in adults,,,,the vet gave younger dogs a chance in my book lol lol lol

what happens now if insane jane runs in vets next year ,,,,wow,,,,i think she is still good enough to kick the younger dogs ass :thumbsup: