Judging

[neave]

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I was wondering how long do you think you should be showing before you get judging appointments and should you be a consistant winner at a high level before you become a Judge? or are people happy enough for those who have been showing for a short period of time to do all the judging seminers and then get Jugding appointments awarded through this system?

I prefer a experience Judge who has been in the breed for a while and who has been a constant winner, just my thought!

 

[~JO~]

Championship show level or Open?

My thought for Open as this is obviously where people start off is that they should have about 5ish years experience showing the breed before they judge, I have heard this figure quoted many times before. I have to say it took me careful consideration to accept my first Open show appointment.

 

[JAX]

It all depends on the person involved IMO .

Some folks have an `eye` for a good specimin of the the breed , what ever breed it is ,

Just because you may have done well with your first whippet/s dosnt mean you will make a good judge. 8)

Judging from OUTSIDE the ring , is far easier than judging from INSIDE it too :- "

TBH Im not too keen on this fast track system thats the KC now has in place, I feel whippets are being`used ` as a stepping stone for group judging

Some of these people do a good job , but alot just put up well known faces( playing save) and really struggle with the class should there be no one they recognise One such judge ( who I didnt enter under) asked , is it right brindles are better quality whippets than other colours ? (w00t) :rant: They seem to think whippets are easy to judge

I suppose I havnt really answered your question , :wacko: but a while back we did have a thread on `how long did it take to judge open shows , give CCs etc . Perhaps one of the clever folk on here can :thumbsup: find the link again .

Of course the best way to start would be stewarding , helping at ringcraft , judging match nights etc , just so you can`go over a dog and learn `ring etiqueit sp?

 

[marier05]

Cool only 3 years to go for me! (w00t)

 

[bertha]

I started serious showing in 1973 when I registered my affix. In those days you waited to be asked to judge. I had my first open show appointment in 1986! I had judged matches and loads of exemption shows, run a ring craft club, gaining experience all the time.

You can attend all the seminars, do all the hoop jumping you like, but don't rush to judge. Just because you have passed exams, assessments will not make you a good judge if you have not got an eye for a dog, it is something you cannot explain, you either have it or not.

I have watched people make terrible mistakes judging breeds they know nothing about, and why people think whippets are easy to judge is beyond me.

IMO you should have been involved in the breed for at least five years, preferable seven or eight.

It was always an honour to be asked to judge, and one did not promote oneself sending cv's out. How it has changed. :- "

 

[quintessence]

It all depends on the person involved IMO .
Some folks have an `eye` for  a good specimin of the the breed , what ever breed it is ,

Just because you may have done well with your first whippet/s dosnt mean you will make a good judge. 8)

Judging from OUTSIDE the ring , is far easier than judging from INSIDE it too  :- "

TBH Im not too keen on this fast track system thats the KC now has in place, I feel whippets are being`used ` as a stepping stone for group judging 

Some of these people do a good job , but alot just put up well known faces( playing save) and really struggle with the class should there be no one they recognise  One such judge ( who I didnt enter under) asked , is it right brindles are better quality whippets  than other colours ? (w00t)   :rant: They seem to think whippets are easy to judge

I suppose I havnt really answered your question , :wacko:   but a while back we did have a thread on `how long did it take to judge open shows , give CCs etc . Perhaps one of the clever folk on here can  :thumbsup: find the link again .

Of course the best way to start would be stewarding , helping at ringcraft , judging match nights etc , just so you can`go over a dog and learn `ring etiqueit sp?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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Is this is the thread you mean Jax.

http://www.k9community.co.uk/forums/index....topic=44266&hl=

Jenny

 

[JAX]

It is still an honour to be asked to judge Ann .

esp when you have got the appointment through reputation

Thats why most people feel really really honoured to be invited to judge a breed club

When I have to ask for a judging appoinment I will stop judging o

Thats the one Jenny :cheers:

 

[T Hoare]

I agree with Jax & Bertha.

I do not like the new (probably older than I think!!) fast track system.

It seems everyone is in such a rush to do things these days. You learn an awful lot by watching at the ringside, studying dogs movement etc. It really isn't as easy as it looks to judge, as many judges with many years experience will confirm.

 

[quintessence]

I have been having a tidy up on the computer and I found this paragraph I had saved from The Guardian Crufts blog, I love it

Jenny

"As experts in a particular breed, the breeders who breed that breed are, in turn, experts of the experts who stand in judgement over their dogs, and quietly judge the judges."

Genius

 

[JAX]

(w00t)

Of course [SIZE=21pt]I[/SIZE] understand that completely :- " :lol:

 

[shenace]

I have been having a tidy up on the computer and I found this paragraph I had saved from The Guardian Crufts blog, I love it
Jenny

"As experts in a particular breed, the breeders who breed that breed are, in turn, experts of the experts who stand in judgement over their dogs, and quietly judge the judges."

Genius

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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BRILLIANT :thumbsup:

I don't agree that you have to be in a breed for a long time to be a good judge... and completely agree with JAX that some folks have a 'good eye for a specimen' regardless of the breed :cheers:

We have some breeders who have been in the breed for 150yrs :wacko: they don't necessarily understand the breed standard & don't breed to it either.. but they have "Years of Service" - doesn't mean they would make the best judges :sweating:

I do think for judges coming thru that whippets are a hard breed to judge. Speaking from our wee corner of the world - we have a lot of quality whippets with varying types - some I like, some I don't particularly care for but are still nice specimens of the breed.

 

[seaspot_run]

The basic rule of thumb over here is 12-5-4 if you want to be a judge of your breed and are a breeder (there are separate criteria for professional handlers).

Twelve years in your breed.

5 litters whelped and raised on your premises

4 champions finished from your litters in the breed you are applying for.

Then, you also have to have ring stewarded and you have to done a certain number of qualifying assignments such as sanction matches, futurities and specialty sweepstakes.

Once you have satisfactorily served out your provisional assignments and gotten passing marks from the AKC rep who will be watching you, you can be licensed officially and apply for more breeds if you go through the educational process. This would include some combination of additional judging assignments for those breeds, breeder-education and seminars given by the parent club, attendance at specialty shows and ringside mentoring by prominent breeders.

 

[seaspot_run]

I don't think that being a great breeder and being a great judge necessarily go together.

Some people have a wonderful eye for other people's dogs but are a bit too emotional about their own to have that little bit of ruthlessness that truly successful top breeders have to have if they are to make those tough decisions. Others are hampered by lack of money or lack of support at home, and simply haven't been able to put together a good run as a breeder as a result. But these same people can make wonderful judges. I can think of many examples of breeder/judges over here who I think are very fine judges, and it would be a mistake to assume that what they will put up is going to be the same thing they have at home.

Some very talented breeders, IMO, who have bred so many top dogs and admired producers, seem to get bogged down in details when judging and end up lacking the decisive clarity of rendering an opinion which is the hallmark of a good judge. Deprived of the luxury of days and weeks to observe in great detail every aspect of their own dogs, they can't get to that decision point quickly enough in the ring with less than 2 minutes to observe, or perhaps they don't hold a class of 20-30 dogs well enough in their head. Not sure, but some of the more talented breeders seem to just flounder when they get into the ring as a judge. I think most of these get weeded out in the qualifying process because they find they don't enjoy judging very much as a result and so after they've done some sweepstakes and so forth, they decide they will stick with where their true talents lie--breeding great dogs for others to judge.

Karen Lee

 

[neave]

Cheers for all your replies i think it is important to learn as much as you can about the bred from watching from the ring side, helping stewarding asking whippet people lots of questions, reading etc .......... Am not to keen on this fast tracking system either as i think its just a way for people to jump in to the judging scene too quickly!!! :rant:

Judging isnt for everyone it is a very difficult job and often sometimes a very thankless job :lol: :lol:

I am keen to do a bit of Judging and having been hounred to be invited to Judge my first open show this year :sweating: :sweating:

So if anyone has any tips throw them my way please :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[bertha]

Make sure you know the ring procedure and how you want your dogs placed, if you have a knowledgable steward that helps. Make sure you know the breed standard, don't fault judge and be honest.

The KC do a booklet on the duties of a of a dog show judge, worth sending for. If you don't feel up to it, don't take it on!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good luck.

:cheers:

 

[quintessence]

I can't think of any better words of advice than those of Shakespeare

To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man.

I'm not sure if Shakespeare judged but he was well-known aound the Midland shows with his greyhound Hamlet Prince of Denmark.

I can't believe I just made that up, but I'm leaving it in for comedy value

 

[JAX]

Very funny Jenny :lol: , you get better with age :lol:

 

[alfyn]

Don't encourage her Jackie :lol:

 

[JAX]

Don't encourage her Jackie   :lol:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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Why not , someone has too :blink: , maybe she should be on the stage

sweeping up :lol:

 

[neave]

Am a bit young too remember Shakespeare :lol: :lol: :lol: thanks for the words of wisdom though :thumbsup: