Puppy diarrhoea constantly

[bombolone]

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My puppy has had diarrhoea constantly since we got him. He is almost 5 months and we got him at 8 weeks.

His first poo of the day is firm-ish and all subsequent ones runny in varying degrees.

I now realise that many of my other 'problems' with the puppy could be stemming from this - e.g. night waking etc.

We had his stool tested at by the vet and everything was clear.

We have tried 4 different food brands in the hope that would help. We do not overfeed him as far as I am aware. His appetite is huge and he is very skinny. He eats EVERYTHING though e.g. in garden, twigs, soil, bark, his own poo (gross).

Not sure what to do next.

Foods we have tried:

Lily's Kitchen

Orijen

Guru

and he is now on Millie's Wolfheart Countryside (which he loves)

We err on the 'too little' side and take treats from his daily ration wherever possible.

On Millie's Wolfheart's suggestion we are about to start on a different Millie's formulation with slightly less protein (60/40 instead of 70/30).

Some have said that exercise can make puppy's poo runny and it's fine but a couple of other people have said to me that that may be true but it really isn't 'right'... Given that he is skinny and always hungry I would tend to agree with the latter. He won't be getting all the nutrients he needs.

Does anyone here have any experience of similar problems or thoughts for a resolution?

 

[hollysh]

That's a strange one if his poos have been tested and everything is clear. It doesn't sound right. Though him eating everything in the garden won't be helping. Dogs do have strange habits though. I have noticed elastic bands in my dogs poo the last few times I've taken him out. he's an odd ball.

Have you tried distracting him with chew toys or balls when he starts to chew things that he shouldnt? Also does he drink plenty of water during the day? as having so much diarrhoea I can imagine will cause a lot of dehydration.

 

[bombolone]

Thanks for your thoughts hollysh... I agree it doesn't sound right with all the tests clear.

I think WHAT he picks off the ground is so varied yet the diarrhoea is so constant (even on days he doesn't get much access to rubbish on ground) that I can safely assume the ground-stuff is not the main cause. Even so, I do try to distract him as much as possible but some things he will not stop - he is quite fond of eating grass?! Balls don't do it for him - he just ignores them most of the time! He does drink water in the day, lots of it

Any suggestions of good chew toys or toys in general? Kongs are all very well and everyone goes on and on about them and he of course loves them but they involve FOOD and if you are trying to limit the food intake for sensitive tummy, it is hard to know what kind of thing to give for them to chew on.... he likes the softest nylabone a bit but any of the harder ones he is not interested in. Rope toys, not much interest. In the garden he LOVES the bark and even lumps of concrete (he is teething). But I have yet to find toys he really loves other than one soft toy that he occasionally humps, licks or uses as his pillow!!

 

[hollysh]

Ah bless him. He seems very sweet. I have heard dogs tend to eat grass to make themselves sick. Though since I've been dog walking/sitting I've noticed most dogs do it generally. I expect they are interested in the smells of the spring and what it tastes like. I know a lot of dogs don't like balls. Most of mine don't. A couple of them carry them round but not eager to bring them back apart from my Labrador I take out twice a week. I take her out just to throw a ball for her to catch I had a rubber duck from a gift set I had that squeaked and my dogs went nuts for it. They managed to eat its beak off though. So not sure if it was particularly safe When I've had dogs sit with me, I've had a variety of things their owners bring to keep them entertained. I don't really know names of dog toys but I suppose the easiest way is taking him to a pet store near you and seeing what appeals to him. I have 2 by me and I take them in regularly

 

[bombolone]

hmmm hadn't thought of that, thank you holly. I guess one of those big supermarket-y ones is the way to go. In the small pet shop he just goes straight for the food area and goes CRAZYYYY!!!! He is half retriever so I really think he SHOULD like balls!! I need to train him how to do it all properly I guess....

 

[excuseme]

I feed raw to my lot (their poo's are extremely firm), but I do use "Millies Wolfheart" for emergencies.

I use the 50/50 for puppies in small amounts which is not too rich, it has a good amount of herbs, botanicals and vegetables, and they get their raw meat too.

I would suggest that you start with the Millies Wolfheart lower protein types 19%, Lamb and veg or Duck and veg, this will introduce your pup to their products carefully and if you feel the need after a couple of months to up the protein (if the tummy and poo's are ok) change with care!

Millies is a good choice, just don't offer too much too quickly.

Enjoy!

 

[gypsysmum2]

There are conditions that dogs can get which can cause diarrhoea. Has he had tests to rule them all out. One of these is called Pancreatic Insufficiency and it is fairy common in German Shepherd Dogs. It is incurable but treatable.

Of course he may be allergic to something. All of these things can be investigated by your vet. If he is drinking lots it is because the diarrhoea is dehydrating him.

With eating his own poo - I have had a lot of success in feeding natural yoghurt. It takes a little while to take effect. In bad cases a course of a pro biotic might help but I am sure your vet has already tried these for his diarrhoea?

 

[bombolone]

Ahh very helpful advice excuse and gypsysmum2. Thank you very much.

I didn't know Millie's did a puppy food - will persevere with current (new!) bag of 60/40 and if that doesn't work out will buy 50/50 next time. What you say is reassuring though - that we might be moving in the right direction by downing the protein levels... Thank you.

Gypsysmum2. I think I need to find out what tests the vet did exactly. She certainly didn't test for Pancreatic Insufficiency I know that much. He is a cross between a golden retriever and miniature poodle.

I am really excited to try the yoghurt for the eating of own poo- how much and how often? Is Greek yoghurt OK?! He has had 3 courses of probiotics to try to ease the diarrhoea with little result. I am trying pumpkin at the moment but I feel that even if it works it might be temporary - what happens when you stop the pumpkin? If you could let me know re yoghurt that would be really helpful. I was just googling a product called "stool repel" but it doesn't get very good reviews!

Thank you - I really appreciate your support...

 

[excuseme]

Not actually a puppy food as such but my puppies do eat small amounts without and tummy upsets, their main diet is raw meat and plenty of raw bones.

Millies NEVER turns their poo's soft!

gypsysmum suggestion to offer yoghurt is a good idea and can very often work. You will need to get "Natural Live" yoghurt, supermarket economy is just fine!

 

[excuseme]

Sent the same post twice so deleted this one !!

 

[bombolone]

Thank you both! Haw mich yoghurt would you recommend? A tablespoon at each of the three meals??

 

[excuseme]

Personally I would probably use a desert spoon full twice a day, but what size dog is he ?

You don't want to cause more trouble with too much dairy product !

Gypsysmum may have a better idea than me.

My lot just never get runny tummies or soft poo's, my last puppy that I bought 5 years ago was on a kibble when she came and I changed her over to a raw meat and bone diet within 2 days.

You are staying on a kibble diet which is quiet different.

 

[gypsysmum2]

A dessertspoonful twice a day should be fine. Not holding out much hope, though, as the probiotic has been tried and failed.

Have you considered asking for a specialist referral? Do keep going back to the same vet. If yours is a large practice, as many are now, it is important to have continuity. Try, when a dog has a difficult condition, to choose a senior member of the practice and stick with them. They will get booked up but just stand your ground and insist on seeing the same vet at each visit. Tell the vet all the things you have tried and describe the condition as accurately as possible.

 

[bombolone]

Thanks for your advice gypsysmum2. I think I do need to go back.... I think I want to go to another vet though. My instincts tell me that the vet I am with is not right....

 

[bombolone]

The vet I am with just keeps saying we must try feeding him chicken and rice or fish and rice (both made no difference) OR tries to push a branded 'sensitive tummy' product on us (Royal Canin - arg). I think another vet has to be the way forward. What do you think?

 

[gypsysmum2]

Yes, definitely another vet. Bland diet is always the first line of defence but if it doesn't work then more investigations are needed.

Do not be embarrassed about seeking a second opinion. It happens all the time. The new vet will ask for your notes from the old vet themselves. You do not have to do anything other than find a good vet. Try to find an independent one as they are likely to be around for years. The large vet practices get through their vets like, well like puppy diarrhoea through a sieve!

 

[bombolone]

Ahhh that's good advice about vets (nice analogy!), thank you. Also good to hear about the new vet getting info from the old one without me having to get involved, good to know. I need to put the insurance claim in for the stool tests we have had done first though-cost a fortune. Easier said than done finding an independent one - they all seem to be part of a 'chain'.

 

[gypsysmum2]

If you go to the RCVS website you can search for vets. I have just done it and there is no way, that I could see, of finding out if they are independent from that website. The big companies, like CVS in this area, were very clever when they took over many of the local vets because they kept the old practice name going. The old practice would have had a good reputation and so people recommend them. If you go into each vet's website you might be able to find out if they are owned by one of the big boys. I am not saying they don't employ good vets but the vets are put under a lot of pressure and tend to leave after a year or two. Often foreign vets come in as locums and then there can be language barriers.

You may have to ask around and get personal recommendations. There are only two in my area that are still independent and both are a bit of a distance (about 13 miles). This worries me in an emergency but I will cross that bridge when I come to it. I am sure any vet could treat an emergency if necessary.

 

[bombolone]

gypsysmum2 you are super-helpful. Since your post I have asked around and there is a good independent one - a bit further away but probably worth it. Have booked in for next week! Thank you.

Also gypsysmum2 I have checked which tests my puppy had for his diarrhoea. This is probably too detailed but just incase you know a lot, he was tested for:

Cryptosporidia - Cryptosporidium antigen not detected via EIA

Microscopy - faecal - no ova, larvae or protozoa found

Yersinia - yersinia spp. not isolated

Salmonella - not detected

Campylobacter - not detected

Giardia - not detected

Are there any glaring omissions in terms of what was tested that you know of? It will be interesting to know what the new vet thinks.

 

[gypsysmum2]

Sorry, I am not a vet. Your new vet may come up with some theories though.

Without reading the whole thread again, have you stopped all treats? Was just thinking about an earlier thread where people were using dentastix and they can cause problems.