Bite inhibition - allow or discourage mouthing in young puppy?

[Hal]

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Most people seem to advise against allowing mouthing in v young pups and training against it (chew toys, extinction etc) but some people suggest allowing it and training for more sensitive biting (then phasing it out at around 8m) results in a dog less likely to bite really hard if hurt or frightened (and a slightly chewed owner). Wonder what other people think?

Similarly, but not exactly the same issue: We have enrolled our puppy to be (arrives end Jan hopefully) in a puppy class for end Feb. They do lots of on-lead training and socialisation, but nothing off lead and no 'play fighting', not even with small numbers of dogs with close supervision. Worried that puppy won't learn good bite inhibition. Should we look for a class that does off good, well supervised 'play fighting' and other 'play'?

 

[Tinytom]

I have always encouraged bite inhibition. ..to me its very important. ...

 

[JoanneF]

I think the advice to allow biting might have been superseded by newer thinking.

And I would avoid like the plague a class that allows play fighting. I take my pups to classes to learn to focus on me, not on other puppies. That helps later on when they go out for walks - I don't want to be that owner, being ignored by my dog who is bogging off over the horizon to seek out another dog to.play with.

 

[Hemlock]

I think the advice to allow biting might have been superseded by newer thinking.

And I would avoid like the plague a class that allows play fighting. I take my pups to classes to learn to focus on me, not on other puppies. That helps later on when they go out for walks - I don't want to be that owner, being ignored by my dog who is bogging off over the horizon to seek out another dog to.play with.

And I don't want to be that person whose dog is being plagued by offlead dogs of whatever age charging up to her.

Puppies know how to be puppies. We train them so that they can occupy a safe and happy space in a world that isn't geared to dogs. We don't want them to think every outing is a social club. We need them to be dog-neutral, seeing other dogs as scenery not opportunities to harass. This doesn't mean they won't have dog "friends" that they can interact nicely with. We can arrange who and what our dogs enjoy the company of by permission not as a right.

It's great that you are asking these questions, Hal. You are going to be such a good dog-owner.

 

[Hal]

I think the advice to allow biting might have been superseded by newer thinking.

And I would avoid like the plague a class that allows play fighting. I take my pups to classes to learn to focus on me, not on other puppies. That helps later on when they go out for walks - I don't want to be that owner, being ignored by my dog who is bogging off over the horizon to seek out another dog to.play with.

Thanks Joanne - also thanks for the phrase - "bogging off" - great verb, I'm going to borrow it and use it as much as I can Happy Christmas!

 

[Hal]

And I don't want to be that person whose dog is being plagued by offlead dogs of whatever age charging up to her.

Puppies know how to be puppies. We train them so that they can occupy a safe and happy space in a world that isn't geared to dogs. We don't want them to think every outing is a social club. We need them to be dog-neutral, seeing other dogs as scenery not opportunities to harass. This doesn't mean they won't have dog "friends" that they can interact nicely with. We can arrange who and what our dogs enjoy the company of by permission not as a right.

It's great that you are asking these questions, Hal. You are going to be such a good dog-owner.

Thank you Hemlock, what a nice thing to say! Have a great Christmas

 

[Hal]

I have always encouraged bite inhibition. ..to me its very important. ...

How do you do that - do you just discourage any mouthing, or do you work to train sensitivity?

 

[Hal]

I think the advice to allow biting might have been superseded by newer thinking.

And I would avoid like the plague a class that allows play fighting. I take my pups to classes to learn to focus on me, not on other puppies. That helps later on when they go out for walks - I don't want to be that owner, being ignored by my dog who is bogging off over the horizon to seek out another dog to.play with.

Hi Joanne,
The advice on puppy classes is helpful and reassuring. I actually sent a bit of text from your message to the person who runs the class we are booked on in late Feb. She liked it

 

[Hal]

I think the advice to allow biting might have been superseded by newer thinking.

And I would avoid like the plague a class that allows play fighting. I take my pups to classes to learn to focus on me, not on other puppies. That helps later on when they go out for walks - I don't want to be that owner, being ignored by my dog who is bogging off over the horizon to seek out another dog to.play with.

Hi Joanne,
I'm just reading a great book called 'Culture Clash' by Jean Donaldson (2012), entirely reward only and she is entertainingly scathing about 'correction based' trainers, particularly those who claim to rely on praise only (she suggests they always end using aversive techniques.
She is however, like Ian Dunbar, a strong advocate of allowing or even encouraging young puppies to mouth and bite to train for sensitivity. I liked her description of this and although I'm not mad keen on getting my hand chewed, it is making think again about training for bite inhibition by offering myself a chew-toy up the age of about 5 or 6 months (a chew toy with sound effects to encourage a soft mouth!).
I'll keep thinking and reading but any further advice on mouthing would be much appreciated.

4 weeks now till the puppy arrives