Body language in play

[JoanneF]

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Sorry, no video.

But I was out this morning and within five minutes of each other, I saw two really interesting displays.

First was a group of four dogs. A Newfoundland and adolescent St Bernard belonging to owner #1 and a yellow Lab and black Lab belonging to owner #2.

The Newfie and St B were very boisterous, the black Lab was fine but the yellow was turning away, stiffening, trying to avoid, ears back and tail at 4 o'clock. Unfortunately the owners were oblivious until the dog gave a perfectly appropriate growl and air snap (which I could clearly see was coming). And sadly, she was given a row herself by her owner

Then, I met a man coming towards me with a Retriever. I stopped to pick up T's poo and turned back on myself, so I saw them further down the path with another retriever haring towards them at full speed. I mentally braced for an impact but the dogs clearly knew each other well and they engaged in a very well matched play session that they were both loving.

Two very different events, just minutes apart.

There's a proposal to build a dog park in our town. I'm afraid it's not something I will use, for exactly the reasons in my first example. I have no objection to it being built, provided it isn't used as a means of trying to keep dogs away from other areas and I still have other places to walk.

 

[Hemlock]

Play as a behaviour is not benign. Nor is human "play". It is an assessment of the strengths/weaknesses of the other dog(s). It can morph into seemingly benign as long as each dog is well-matched with the other, but in group situations it can spin on a hairpin into bullying and even attack. I often told my clients to go to the park without their dog and watch the interactions of communication as dogs approach each other, before they meet, as they meet and when they depart (this is often when one dog will go for another). We should avoid calling our dogs away from dodgy situations, as when they are distracted is when the other dog will attack. It then poisons the recall cue for the future. Sometimes I'd go there with my clients and without their dog if they were new to dog body-language and needed support and explanation.

Really, along with "socialisation" the wrong word is used for what goes on. "Play" can go wrong so quickly, but in reality it is not designed to go "right". It's a survival mode. I encouraged clients to play with their dogs themselves and avoid dog/dog unless they really knew what was going on.

 

[JoanneF]

Thank you @Hemlock, that's really interesting.

 

[JudyN]

Round here, dog owners are being 'encouraged' to walk their dogs in a few designated areas, by enforcing lead-only rules on the heathland. The designated areas are too small for a 'proper' walk and will get busier. I can appreciate that they want to protect the environment, particularly the ground-nesting birds, but it's far better for the dogs to walk in areas where they only occasionally encounter other dogs and it's easy to avoid interaction. Many of my happiest times were with Jasper in the middle of acres of heathland, not another person in sight... and wondering if I'd got lost again.

 

[Feverfew]

I agree with that Hemlock - I always prefer to see dogs engaged in companionship rather than play. I think it's often driven by what people like to see -, if they think the play is 'fun' and they find it exciting and amusing, it's quite hard to convince them that what is going on is definitely not fun for the dogs, it's more like hard work trying to keep things from spilling over, and very stressful - especially if like the yellow Labrador you mentioned Joanne, you get told of for a perfectly reasonable response which most dogs would understand and respect.

I saw some interesting data years ago on how street dogs in Bangalore spend their time, and almost one third was spent sleeping. The next biggest category was grooming, then scavenging. Time spent playing was a tiny percentage, virtually nil.
I can see why people want dog parks, but I think it's an awful idea! Throwing a load of dogs into a confined space and expecting them all to get along just fine. And of course it could lead to more restrictions elsewhere, which would be a shame, because people (and children especially) do need tp encounter dogs and get to know how to behave around them.

 

[Flobo]

With the dog's I walk something I would really like to see is people not just being more aware of a dog's body language but the walkers too.
Very rarely someone will actually notice me suddenly change direction, head behind a bush to obscure the vision, keep my dogs attention on me or that I'm walking my dog on a bright yellow lead that says 'I Need Space' and they will call their dog, or place them on a lead while they pass for example. The worst is when you see a dog clock yours and you know it's going to come over and the owners not even looking and when I shout for them to please call their dog back, their response is 'don't worry he/she is friendly'
The majority of my dogs I walk on lead(for a variety of reasons), I wish it would become a common understanding that it's best to presume if a dog is on lead it's for a reason and to endeavour to keep your dog from approaching. But then to make that presumption, one has to notice in the first place!
I'm doing a stall this year at our RSPCA summer fair so I'm thinking of doing a bit of a 'Mindful dog walking' promotion! (or does that sound too new age/hippy? I don't want to put people off..)

 

[JoanneF]

'Mindful dog walking' promotion! (or does that sound too new age/hippy?

You could always call it something like Walking Manners, Considerate Dog Walking, or similar?

 

[JudyN]

Whatever you call it, Flobo, it's an excellent idea. I think 'Mindful dog walking' is fine - there's a difference between 'being mindful' and 'mindfulness'.

 

[carl99]

The Newfie and St B were very boisterous, the black Lab was fine but the yellow was turning away, stiffening, trying to avoid, ears back and tail at 4 o'clock. Unfortunately the owners were oblivious until the dog gave a perfectly appropriate growl and air snap (which I could clearly see was coming). And sadly, she was given a row herself by her owner

Yeah thats a shame, it sounds like it would have been better for the the Newfie owner to notice the annoyance and quickly try get Newfie to back off and chill.

Was the size of the Newfie a factor in the yellow feeling intimidated do you think?

 

[Feverfew]

With the dog's I walk something I would really like to see is people not just being more aware of a dog's body language but the walkers too.
Very rarely someone will actually notice me suddenly change direction, head behind a bush to obscure the vision, keep my dogs attention on me or that I'm walking my dog on a bright yellow lead that says 'I Need Space' and they will call their dog, or place them on a lead while they pass for example. The worst is when you see a dog clock yours and you know it's going to come over and the owners not even looking and when I shout for them to please call their dog back, their response is 'don't worry he/she is friendly'
The majority of my dogs I walk on lead(for a variety of reasons), I wish it would become a common understanding that it's best to presume if a dog is on lead it's for a reason and to endeavour to keep your dog from approaching. But then to make that presumption, one has to notice in the first place!
I'm doing a stall this year at our RSPCA summer fair so I'm thinking of doing a bit of a 'Mindful dog walking' promotion! (or does that sound too new age/hippy? I don't want to put people off..)

Sounds like a great idea Flobo!

Things have changed in terms of dog etiquette since I first owned dogs. It was an unwritten rule that if a dog was on a lead, you didn't let your dog approach it but that seems to have been forgotten by most people.

I heard recently that 39% of current dog owners are first-time owners, which is pretty shocking and possibly due to pandemic purchases. Not that new owners are necessarily bad, but maybe don't always have the experience needed to spot trouble before it starts.

 

[JoanneF]

Yeah thats a shame, it sounds like it would have been better for the the Newfie owner to notice the annoyance and quickly try get Newfie to back off and chill.

Was the size of the Newfie a factor in the yellow feeling intimidated do you think?

I don't know, to be honest. Two big, exuberant dogs seemed to be just too much for her.