Bones

[mdkel]

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I would guess he's just naturally reserved - he's not a touchy-feely dog. But if people insist on petting him when he doesn't really enjoy it, he could become more shy/cautious, then fearful, and possibly even get snappy. If everyone who you met on a walk gave you a quick fondle... well you get the picture!

I would tell everyone that he doesn't like being touched/petted, and ask them not to touch him unless he approaches them. Then they could give him a quick rub on the neck or chest (often dogs hate hands over the head) and leave it at that unless he clearly requests more. It shouldn't be about him letting people pet him, he should want it. You'll probably have to be firm - a lot of people expect all dogs to be like labs and spaniels and have no clue of the doggy body language that shows he's only tolerating being touched.




Oh, I'm just the same! I spend far too long talking dog!

So, today as I was walking Zappa, we encontour a little 6 month cocker spaniel that zappa already met before, and played too. today, zappa seemed to be very playful with him, wagging his tail, but in the air, nose down, the little pup is full of energy, always jumping towards zappa, and suddenly zappa growled a bit (maybe 1 or 2 secs growl). I was surprised but it did not seemed he wanted to hurt the puppy, he continued to be with his tail waggling and jumping etc, the cockerspaniel owner was surprised too, she asked me if he would bite her puppy. Immediatly I took zappa from the "play", and he growled a bit more (once again, 1 or 2 secs). The cocker owner said that he seemed very very playful (I thought the same) and happy.

My question is: Is zappa becoming aggressive with other dogs? a bully with other dogs? or is it just his growling is getting more adult (like a young boy changing his voice) ?? He seemed very normal, but I did not expect the growling part and is starting to worry me... Any ideas?

 

[JudyN]

What breed/cross do you think he is?

 

[mdkel]

I have no idea... Most people say he seems to have some hunting dog mix... I cant see any type of bred

 

[mdkel]

What do you think ?? I havesome videos of him but I dont know how to upload them

He looks a bit like youre dog, except zappa has small hair, and different colour

 

[JudyN]

I'm just thinking that lurchers can be quite intense in play, and growling can be involved - and he does look quite leggy.

I think in general (bearing in mind I'm not an expert and I haven't seen Zappa in action) proper aggression tends to be preceded by a freeze and a hard look. The actual growling can be quite low-key - sometimes if Jasper is on lead and doesn't like a dog he meets I can't hear him, but I can feel the lead vibrate. If Zappa's actions look like play my guess is that you don't have to worry about the vocals - it could easily be play-growls.

I would still step in, because even play can also be bullying - 'I can so roll you over and not let you get up again!' - and it's not nice for the other dog. In fact, when watching Jasper play I'm watching the other dog more than I'm watching him. As Zappa interacts with more dogs, hopefully you'll get more of a feel for what his motives are.

 

[mdkel]

I'm just thinking that lurchers can be quite intense in play, and growling can be involved - and he does look quite leggy.

I think in general (bearing in mind I'm not an expert and I haven't seen Zappa in action) proper aggression tends to be preceded by a freeze and a hard look. The actual growling can be quite low-key - sometimes if Jasper is on lead and doesn't like a dog he meets I can't hear him, but I can feel the lead vibrate. If Zappa's actions look like play my guess is that you don't have to worry about the vocals - it could easily be play-growls.

I would still step in, because even play can also be bullying - 'I can so roll you over and not let you get up again!' - and it's not nice for the other dog. In fact, when watching Jasper play I'm watching the other dog more than I'm watching him. As Zappa interacts with more dogs, hopefully you'll get more of a feel for what his motives are.

The thing is this is the first dog I have that I can not "read"... I cant distinguish between just playin or aggresiion in him... He seemed to be playing, but also seemed that he wanted to bite the other puppy. They were both on lead.. When he was about 3 month old (3 and 1/2), if a dog was too energetic for him, he would freeze a bit, put his body in a down/curved motion and showed his teeth but never growled or snapped or bited another dog. In the dog park, when the pitbull trys to mount him 345 times in a row, he shows his teeth and does a very low growl (like "hey stop it or else").

But today he just seemed a mix of playin and attacking, but he wasn't at all frozen or staring (but energeticly jumping in the puppy direction), I couldnt see if he was showing his teeth though.

I think I need a traier/behaviourist

As for the lurcher, maybe... Here in Portugal we have a breed called Podengo, they are hunting dogs, super active, very very resistent and very brave, maybe a mix of that? I really cant tell. His brothers and sister were all so different from him (2 tottally black, 1 totally white, and 3 or 4 brown and white, zappa was the only like this).

 

[JoanneF]

@JudyN is right, it is impossible to say for sure what is happening without seeing him but even if it is play it isn't good play and another dog might either put him in his place, or he might get used to doing this and become too big for his boots.

But when you said other dogs try to mount him, and he growls, that does sound like he is warning them off (quite reasonably, he shouldn't have to put up with that). You don't want this to be his default behaviour with every dog - which is a distinct possibility. So this makes me wonder if that is at the root of this, he might be acting out of anxiety. When a dog is too anxious they will go into fight or flight. It is possible he is getting the first strike, to warn off the other dogs just in case they do something he dislikes.

The answer is still the same, you need to step up and intervene. Don't let other dogs mount him, that's really not fair on him. Tell the other owner to control their dog or just keep him away. And the advice yesterday about controlling his play still applies.

 

[mdkel]

@JudyN is right, it is impossible to say for sure what is happening without seeing him but even if it is play it isn't good play and another dog might either put him in his place, or he might get used to doing this and become too big for his boots.

But when you said other dogs try to mount him, and he growls, that does sound like he is warning them off (quite reasonably, he shouldn't have to put up with that). You don't want this to be his default behaviour with every dog - which is a distinct possibility. So this makes me wonder if that is at the root of this, he might be acting out of anxiety. When a dog is too anxious they will go into fight or flight. It is possible he is getting the first strike, to warn off the other dogs just in case they do something he dislikes.

The answer is still the same, you need to step up and intervene. Don't let other dogs mount him, that's really not fair on him. Tell the other owner to control their dog or just keep him away. And the advice yesterday about controlling his play still applies.

It's only the pitbull in the dog park that mounts him, and zappa does not growl, he just shows his teeth but I can tell he does not like it. the owner is not a very bright person, the pit is overweight and does want he wants to do, its and accident wainting to happen. he just does a very small and low growl, just a warning I guess. But that's Where I get confused, when he was playing with the pup, the growl was very very loud and deep , but super fast too

 

[JoanneF]

Dogs give a series of signals that they are unhappy, but unfortunately most people don't recognise them because they can be quite subtle. To begin with there is often wide eyes, lip licking and yawning. There is also muscular tension in the body. Then the ones we sometimes do see - growl, snarl, nip then bite. If the early signals are not seen (or, in the dog's view, ignored) he won't bother with them because us stupid humans pay no attention anyway; so he may go straight to the bite. So it's important never to ignore a growl.

You might find the illustrationbelow helpful. But please, stop the Pit mounting him. However firm you need to be with the owner. It is simply not acceptable. If it were my dog being mounted, and the owner didn't stop it, I would either walk elsewhere or tell the owner I would be forcibly removing it if it did it again.

 

[mdkel]

Dogs give a series of signals that they are unhappy, but unfortunately most people don't recognise them because they can be quite subtle. To begin with there is often wide eyes, lip licking and yawning. There is also muscular tension in the body. Then the ones we sometimes do see - growl, snarl, nip then bite. If the early signals are not seen (or, in the dog's view, ignored) he won't bother with them because us stupid humans pay no attention anyway; so he may go straight to the bite. So it's important never to ignore a growl.

You might find the illustrationbelow helpful. But please, stop the Pit mounting him. However firm you need to be with the owner. It is simply not acceptable. If it were my dog being mounted, and the owner didn't stop it, I would either walk elsewhere or tell the owner I would be forcibly removing it if it did it again.
View attachment 111974623

I immediatly took the pit off of zappa as soon as I saw zappa was not liking it. And when the pit is there, I go eslewhere.
As for the growling part, what confuses me, is that there isn't an escalating or any signals. He is playing, or trying to, and I heard a growl.

I think I'm going to have to hire a trainer, at least they see zappa "in action" and can explain to me if it is aggression, or just too much excitment, or just play....