Can Anyone Tell Me Why?

[ecknnelly]

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Hello, i recently bought a bitch pup, we had been looking for months and found one fairly locally, which would be ready for collection in June allowing us all summer to settle her in before starting uni again. We have a dog whippet already and had thought that one day (not in the near future) perhaps pups may be an option. Although this is dependant on many factors. Both our whippets are pedigrees, our dog comes from a long line of champions and when we bought our girl we were given a five generation certificate of her breeding.

I sent off the owner transfer papers to the kennel club for registration and when I recieved the papers back, I saw an endorsement, I did not know what this was as there is nothing on our boy's papers, so I called the KC and found out that the breeder has places a restiction on the girl disallowing her pups to be KC registered.

The breeder did not mention this when we went to see the pups on the first visit, nor when we picked her up a few weeks later.

Can anyone tell me the protocol for this, should they have told us so that we could have made a informed deicsion to buy a pup from them?

Is it to prevent puppies being brought into the world purely to sell?

Is it to prevent any of her pups being shown in competition?

I really don't know why and the breeder is not being very responsive.

any thought anyone?

thanks

 

[BeeJay]

Personally I think that the breeder should have told you they intended to do this, because it is something that needs to be taken into account when buying a puppy.

It has become much more common for breeders to do this. What they are wanting to do is control the quality of the dogs being bred from.

Normally if the pup turns out to be a good example of the breed then they will lift the endorsement.

Oh and I've moved the topic to here. :thumbsup:

 

[masta]

Hello, i recently bought a bitch pup, we had been looking for months and found one fairly locally, which would be ready for collection in June allowing us all summer to settle her in before starting uni again.  We have a dog whippet already and had thought that one day (not in the near future) perhaps pups may be an option.  Although this is dependant on many factors.  Both our whippets are pedigrees, our dog comes from a long line of champions and when we bought our girl we were given a five generation certificate of her breeding.
I sent off the owner transfer papers to the kennel club for registration and when I recieved the papers back, I saw an endorsement, I did not know what this was as there is nothing on our boy's papers, so I called the KC and found out that the breeder has places a restiction on the girl disallowing her pups to be KC registered.

The breeder did not mention this when we went to see the pups on the first visit, nor when we picked her up a few weeks later.

Can anyone tell me the protocol for this, should they have told us so that we could have made a informed deicsion to buy a pup from them?

Is it to prevent puppies being brought into the world purely to sell?

Is it to prevent any of her pups being shown in competition?

I really don't know why and the breeder is not being very responsive.

any thought anyone?

thanks

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

you should off been told when you bought the pup, the reason for the restriction is control which is fine but it should of been adressed when you purchased the dog who is the breeder? these problems should be flagged to help prospective buyer to be aware

 

[ecknnelly]

Thanks for your reply,

what qualities do you reckon are regarded as 'good' and how will the breeder know this if they are not responding to me at this early stage?

We have only had her four weeks and it feels like we never been without her, we are all bestotted with her as is eck and she is totally the boss (of us all)

:- "

 

[~elizabeth~]

what qualities do you reckon are regarded as 'good' and how will the breeder know this if they are not responding to me at this early stage? 

That's very subjective, even if she didn't turn out to be a good show specimen say, she might turn well be a brilliant lure coursing dog but even so it might not change the breeder's views. You should have been told this from the start, as clearly it might have influenced your decision if you had known.

Also a good breeder should respond promptly and openly to your queries. :unsure:

 

[Karen]

You should most definately have been told of the endorsment before buying your puppy. As others have said it can be lifted at a later date, my guess is the breeder knows of some reason why the puppy should not be bred from and perhaps just assumed you wouldnt anyway. I would never recommend indescriminatory breeding but unregistered pups find good homes too. I would write to the breeder and keep asking why she didnt tell you. IMO not a GOOD breeder.

Glad you love her to bits what ever though :thumbsup:

 

[ecknnelly]

do I have any recourse with the breeder? not to give Nell back, as I couldn't be without her now.... but we paid 'top dollar' for her and the breeder knew that there could be a chance of a litter way off int' future, as I told her all about eck and his pedigree. :blink:

 

[masta]

do I have any recourse with the breeder?  not to give Nell back, as I couldn't be without her now.... but we paid 'top dollar' for her and the breeder knew that there could be a chance of a litter way off int' future, as I told her all  about eck and his pedigree. :blink:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

Ask for a reduction in cost as you have been sold to under false pretense's and if you get know joy take it to a small claims court

 

[~elizabeth~]

do I have any recourse with the breeder?  not to give Nell back, as I couldn't be without her now.... but we paid 'top dollar' for her and the breeder knew that there could be a chance of a litter way off int' future, as I told her all  about eck and his pedigree. :blink:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

Ask for a reduction in cost as you have been sold to under false pretense's and if you get know joy take it to a small claims court

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

Difficult. She is still KC registered herself presumably? It's only any potential offspring that have the endorsement, so if she was advertised as 'suitable for showing', and the breeder charged a premium for this, they haven't actually breached the trade description as you can still show her. :unsure:

 

[noo]

Hopefully the breeder is away or summat and will get back to you soon?

However as a precaution Id be tempted to log every call you make and the responses you do or dont get. Also keep a copy of any written/email correspondence. Regardless of your gorgeous pup, the breeder has taken a lot of money from you in what was supposed to be an honest and 2-way transaction. Get some legal advice?

I've no idea what the laws are but surely if you told her you would possibly want a litter from her then she has definietly sold to you under false pretences?

 

[masta]

do I have any recourse with the breeder?  not to give Nell back, as I couldn't be without her now.... but we paid 'top dollar' for her and the breeder knew that there could be a chance of a litter way off int' future, as I told her all  about eck and his pedigree. :blink:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

Ask for a reduction in cost as you have been sold to under false pretense's and if you get know joy take it to a small claims court

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

Difficult. She is still KC registered herself presumably? It's only any potential offspring that have the endorsement, so if she was advertised as 'suitable for showing', and the breeder charged a premium for this, they haven't actually breached the trade description as you can still show her. :unsure:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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"but we paid 'top dollar' for her and the breeder knew that there could be a chance of a litter way off int' future, as I told her all about eck and his pedigree."

i would expect the breeder to then point out that breeding would be ok but because of the endorsement the pups would not be be able to be registered, at which point buyer would refuse maybe thats why information was witheld

 

[*Lesley*]

Thats very unproffesional IMO the breeder should have gone through all the details with you whether you had planned to breed or not so you could have made an informed decision, the fact that you are having trouble getting a responce from them is very rude :angry: if they are interested enough about the breed to place restrictions then they should be interested enough to follow up their pups and respond to queries :thumbsup:

 

[~elizabeth~]

I just wonder if they've done this before and have thus been very careful in how they worded their advertisments to cover themselves. I've recently discovered myself, in a different sphere, how useless verbal agreements are, even with people who are generally thought to be decent and trustworthy.

Goodluck :luck:

 

[lalena]

very bad show, i have to say :angry: any responsible and caring breeder, regardless of this particular issue, should and would be willing, indeed eager to speak with you as the pups life progresses. this seeming avoidance of communication is setting off alarm bells for me

 

[chelynnah]

The breeder should have informed you, and if they haven't then they've pretty much shot themselves in the foot. It's my understanding that the KC has withdrawn these endorsements in cases where the breeder couldn't prove that they had informed the buyer of them. So unless you signed a contract with the breeder that states the endorsement exists, you would have a pretty good case.

That said, after doing the research on breeding and lines etc, you may decide later that it's not a good match or that they aren't good enough specimens of the breed to mate

Wendy

 

[ecknnelly]

thanks everyone,

I'll write to the breeder and hope that they are just away at the moment! but any other info or simialr experiences/outcomes are welcome.

if it turns out that Nell should not or cannot have pups then the KC reg is not an issue, but i don't think I'd like to bring unregisterable pups into the world as I assumed that there is some kind of code and support system in place for vetting breeders/buyers with pedigree pups, perhaps that's niaive and misguided.

I was introduced to this breeder through a reputable source, so I'll keep my fingers crossed.

bfn

 

[ecknnelly]

So unless you signed a contract with the breeder that states the endorsement exists, you would have a pretty good case.

They did ask me to sign transfer papers, but they said it was just change of ownership details? I did not read anything about endorsements or restistrictions and nothing was said?

 

[chelynnah]

Then if you didn't sign anything separate and the endorsement wasn't pointed out to you when you were given the papers to transfer, then you would have a valid case for the KC to lift the endorsement if you decided to pursue it. There's no guarantee that they will, but they have in the past in similar circumstances.

Wendy

 

[wilfred]

As far as my knowledge goes on this subject, for the endorsement to stay on, the breeder should have explained the endorsement(s) to you at the time of purchase, and to cover themselves (and you), the breeder should also have asked you to sign something verifying that it had been explained to you and that you understood what you were told, and what you were signing for.

If the breeder didn't (a) tell you and (b) ask you to confirm by signing, then they are on very thin ice and it has been known for the KC to lift the endorsement in these circumstances.

I wouldn't advocate anyone breeding "willy-nilly" of course tho.

 

[Seraphina]

I would definitely write to the breeder; point out that you paid top dollar, told them you may want a litter and the restrictions were not mentioned. Then say if they are not willing to resolve this mater, you will lodge a complaint with the KC.

Endorsing their pups papers is the breeders right, BUT the buyer has to be informed, and unless the breeder has a prove he did so I do not think he has a leg to stand on. Did you receive a receipt when you paid deposit or the full amount? If so have a look what exactly is written on it. :luck: :luck: :luck: