Cleft Palate

[Macha]

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I have a query about causes of cleft palates: see http://www.whippetlovers.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=5531

 

[Seraphina]

I do not think that there is a consensus whether it is inherited or not. Pups with congenital problems like cleft palate or spina bifida are usually PTS and not talked about. As I said on the other forum, I had one Whippet pup with CP, she was the only one I ever seen. Every now and then i heard that somebody had one, i never heard of several in the same litter (that is until the post on WL).

In my opinion if it was inherited i would expect that from closely bred lines there would be repeatedly multiples in litters.

 

[dessie]

I would like to know the exact mode of inheritance but I have asked this question of both my own Vet and Geneticists and it seems to be one of 'those' problems where they just shrug their shoulders and say "I dunno"!!! They all seem to agree that it can both be hereditary and multi-factorial but unpredictable as to when you are going to get it.

Personally, I would never have a CP operated on although I do know people who have. I have also seen perfectly normal size puppies, seemingly healthy other than the CP and also diddly little scrawny ones often with other problems like the whole face misshapen, harelips or club feet.

I, personally, also think that it is congenitally allied to any problems you get on the median line, e.g. when you get holes in the umbilicus so that the guts are outside the body cavity.

I have experienced it with the Whippets but it was/is very common in Cocker Spaniels. I have nearly done my head in trying to fathom it out but there really doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it. It crops up when you least expect it and doesn't when you do!!!

 

[wild whippies]

Cleft palate with humans is just as evasive. The cells involved in forming the face actually travel the furthest path during development, disturbances during this time can lead to CP. For this reason I'm surprised there aren't higher incidents of it. I think Dessie's observations are correct as there can often be further other developmental disorders associated.

CP is multi-factoral with genetics and enviroment both playing a role. All patients with CP / hare lips etc go for genetic counselling as adults to see if their offspring could be possibly predisposed to CP. I suspect that as the dog has a natural hare lip to start with, it would be difficult to identify offspring that could potentially be susceptible to CP. It would be interesting to know if Cockers have any identifying factors as there are anatomical ones in humans ( I was told at a lecture that high vaulted palates can be indicitive)

As for surgery, the consultant I worked with did perform CP repairs on puppies (mainly beagles) but he claimed prognosis was always poor. The problem with repairing them is that as growth occurs, further surgery is usually needed.

 

[Macha]

I asked about cleft palate because I meet someone whose whippet bitch had 2 pups with the condition. They were pts as they could not feed properly. the other 3 pups are normal. Neither parent was significantly inbred nor were they very closely related. although the breeders do not intend to have any more litters with this bitch, I wonder what the advice would be re breeding her and/or any of her healthy progeny.

 

[Seraphina]

The bitch that produced my CP baby had all together 20 pups in 3 litters, her dam had 28 pups in 4 litters, all normal. My bitch's daughter and granddaughter never produced this problem. Sire of this CP puppy produced half a dozen off litters and as far as i know mine was the only one.

Lot of info here about both human and dog CP

cleft palate

 

[imperative]

Great info.Thanks.Very interesting read

 

[Seraphina]

CP is multi-factoral with genetics and enviroment both playing a role. All patients with CP / hare lips etc go for genetic counselling as adults to see if their offspring could be possibly predisposed to CP.

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Yes, but we do not breed from affected dogs.

What puzzles me is that so many CP pups have also other problems, while their siblings are normal. Is there another congenital deformity that comes with such a wide selection of other problems? Could it be that the embryo was created with a faulty sperm or/and egg, and survived when usually it would not?

I have raised 33 Whippet pups, and only one had ALL the problems; tail like a pug, stocky little body with very wide chest, dwarf type limbs and CP, it is not easily visible in the photo, as she is stretched while the other fat blobs are curled up.

I do agree about not trying to operate, although when i had the pup, my first question to my vet was going to be "can anything be done". Before I even opened my mouth, he had a one look at me and said "Do not even think about it".

 

[Mattie]

Cleft palates in pups can be cause by mum getting a virus in the early stage of pregnancy. It happened to a friend and they wouldn't breed from the dog or bitch untill they found this out. The bitch did have a virus in the early stages and never had any more CP pups.

 

[Seraphina]

Cleft palates in pups can be cause by mum getting a virus in the early stage of pregnancy.  It happened to a friend and they wouldn't breed from the dog or bitch untill they found this out.  The bitch did have a virus in the early stages and never had any more CP pups.

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Do you know how many pups were in that litter and how many of them had CP? How did they determined that she has had a virus, and can you find out what sort of virus?

 

[Mattie]

Cleft palates in pups can be cause by mum getting a virus in the early stage of pregnancy.  It happened to a friend and they wouldn't breed from the dog or bitch untill they found this out.  The bitch did have a virus in the early stages and never had any more CP pups.

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Do you know how many pups were in that litter and how many of them had CP? How did they determined that she has had a virus, and can you find out what sort of virus?

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I can't remember now but will ask my friend. I know they were very worried about this because they do try to improve the breed, they have reduced the hip scores quite a lot over the years. It took a lot of research before they found the information.

 

[dessie]

Cleft palates in pups can be cause by mum getting a virus in the early stage of pregnancy.  It happened to a friend and they wouldn't breed from the dog or bitch untill they found this out.  The bitch did have a virus in the early stages and never had any more CP pups.

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Do you know how many pups were in that litter and how many of them had CP? How did they determined that she has had a virus, and can you find out what sort of virus?

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I can't remember now but will ask my friend. I know they were very worried about this because they do try to improve the breed, they have reduced the hip scores quite a lot over the years. It took a lot of research before they found the information.

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Obviously not Whippets then??

 

[Seraphina]

Of-course, it is possible that if pressed that the vet would have said something like;

" it could have been caused by anythings, like exposure to some chemicals, or virus she may have caught during pregnancy......." , but I would have expected him to ad that he cannot tell what it actually was.

 

[dessie]

Of-course, it is possible that if pressed that the vet would have said something like;" it could have been caused by anythings, like exposure to some chemicals,  or virus she may have caught during pregnancy......." , but I would have expected him to ad that he cannot tell what it actually was.

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Quite so because the simple answer is that they DON'T know!!!