Crufts Qualification

[Angela Bayley]

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Dogs are judged on their conformation/movement (well, sometimes) against the breed standard, irrespective of whether their owner shows, races, courses or does doodly squit with them and, therefore, each class should be judged the same IMO.

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Exactly, including height

Angela

 

[dessie]

Firstly, excuse if I'm wrong, but I thought live coursing had actually been made illegal, so how dogs can still be winning courses to qualify for Crufts is a bit beyond me.

Are you entirely happy with this state of affairs? In which case I have to ask: why do you choose to have hounds?

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I don't quite understand your question but I am happy to try and answer.

I am very happy living with hounds, (thank you very much) my dogs are free exercised every day twice a day and hunt naturally and I take them lure coursing. Never had an opportunity to live course them but probably would have, had I made the effort. We used to keep gundogs as well, show-bred Cockers & Springers which also were taken out beating and I used to go hunting in my younger days when I had horses so I have no objection to hunting, shooting fishing ............... if that is what you are getting at.

BUT hunting with dogs has been made illegal (whether you agree with that legislation or not) so my question is, how can shows offer classes where one of the qualifications is that they have won at recognised (live) coursing clubs. Societies must start looking at their schedules and re-word the definition of classes.

 

[beaker]

ok black/blue classes are just 'special' classes and although fun and interesting really don't make any difference but i actually think that the racing and coursing classes are VERY valid and hopefully encourage (even if only in a small way) to keep the 'duality" in our breed.

there is plenty of complaining about racing and showing types drifting further apart, surely dropping classes like these is like denying our dogs history and sends out the wrong message :angry:

on the original topic started- i think the qualifying criteria for a numerically strong breed like ours is pretty fair but maybe it does need to be tighter where classes are smaller :thumbsup:

there, thats my tuppence worth

 

[Liz Third]

ok black/blue classes are just 'special' classes and although fun and interesting really don't make any difference but i actually think that the racing and coursing classes are VERY valid and hopefully encourage (even if only in a small way) to keep the 'duality" in our breed.
there is plenty of complaining about racing and showing types drifting further apart, surely dropping classes like these is like denying our dogs history and sends out the wrong message  :angry:

on the original topic started- i think the qualifying criteria for a numerically strong breed like ours is pretty fair but maybe it does need to be tighter where classes are smaller  :thumbsup:

there, thats my tuppence worth 

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I agree that racing and coursing(or lure coursing ) classes are very valid as it does show the public that these entered dogs are capable of doing what they were bred for as well as looking the part of a show whippet, personally I am proud to show that most of mine can compete on the race track. One that is entered this year races every Sunday in the season, has been in the top 3 bitches in our racing club for the last 3 years as well as being a kennel club good citizen silver, has won her class at BSFA lure coursing and has won her stud book number. I think when we have such a versatile breed there is nothing wrong in advertising the fact.

 

[saraquele]

ok black/blue classes are just 'special' classes and although fun and interesting really don't make any difference but i actually think that the racing and coursing classes are VERY valid and hopefully encourage (even if only in a small way) to keep the 'duality" in our breed.
there is plenty of complaining about racing and showing types drifting further apart, surely dropping classes like these is like denying our dogs history and sends out the wrong message  :angry:

on the original topic started- i think the qualifying criteria for a numerically strong breed like ours is pretty fair but maybe it does need to be tighter where classes are smaller  :thumbsup:

there, thats my tuppence worth 

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I agree that racing and coursing(or lure coursing ) classes are very valid as it does show the public that these entered dogs are capable of doing what they were bred for as well as looking the part of a show whippet, personally I am proud to show that most of mine can compete on the race track. One that is entered this year races every Sunday in the season, has been in the top 3 bitches in our racing club for the last 3 years as well as being a kennel club good citizen silver, has won her class at BSFA lure coursing and has won her stud book number. I think when we have such a versatile breed there is nothing wrong in advertising the fact.

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i know there is a diffrence between show bred and working bred whipets ( in some ways ) but it is a shame the breed has alterd and we now have the need for the "special" classes

i agree that the classes should be included etc but what i feel saddend about is ANY whippet SHOULD be capable of doing the racing / coursing/showing etc and i know that a lot of them are but just to see how the breed is seperated when realistically it shouldnt be. a whippet should be a whippet :b jUST MY HO

 

[JAX]

Firstly, excuse if I'm wrong, but I thought live coursing had actually been made illegal, so how dogs can still be winning courses to qualify for Crufts is a bit beyond me.

Are you entirely happy with this state of affairs? In which case I have to ask: why do you choose to have hounds?

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What an odd question :wacko: We have what ever breed we want because thats the breed we want , not so we can race or course it ,

There are dozens of breeds that have no other `job ` in life apart from being our loving and loyal companions . We are lucky in that we can enjoy our whippets doing other things too , and no Im NOT anti hunting , having been hare coursing and hunting in my younger days :- "

 

[zilloot]

Call me cynical but I think it's about time the judges had to qualify for Crufts

It's the amount of 'fixed', 'facey' and downright pathetic judging I've seen on the green carpet that just makes me sad! (And I'm not talking about just whippets.)

I think all judges should have to swear on the bible that they will honestly judge the dog... and then take a lie detector test afterwards to answer questions about why they chose their winners... then we'd get some entertainment.. put that on telly as a new 'reality show'!!!

These people know who they are and should be aware that most find their behaviour disgusting and pathetic...

Right , off my soapbox now

 

[saraquele]

Call me cynical but I think it's about time the judges had to qualify for Crufts
It's the amount of 'fixed', 'facey' and downright pathetic judging I've seen on the green carpet that just makes me sad!  (And I'm not talking about just whippets.)

I think all judges should have to swear on the bible that they will honestly judge the dog... and then take a lie detector test afterwards to answer questions about why they chose their winners... then we'd get some entertainment.. put that on telly as a new 'reality show'!!!

These people know who they are and should be aware that most find their behaviour disgusting and pathetic...

Right , off my soapbox now

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:lol: :lol: :lol: i like it :thumbsup:

now that is a good idea :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[clardia]

Call me cynical but I think it's about time the judges had to qualify for Crufts
It's the amount of 'fixed', 'facey' and downright pathetic judging I've seen on the green carpet that just makes me sad!  (And I'm not talking about just whippets.)

I think all judges should have to swear on the bible that they will honestly judge the dog... and then take a lie detector test afterwards to answer questions about why they chose their winners... then we'd get some entertainment.. put that on telly as a new 'reality show'!!!

These people know who they are and should be aware that most find their behaviour disgusting and pathetic...

Right , off my soapbox now

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I would like a pound for every time I have heard expanations as to why a judge has put up a certain dog/owner other than on the dogs vertues.

Simple answer to this - if you do not trust the Judges honesty -don't waste your money entering under them.

It concerns me more, that I have seen people judging at club level, whom you would expect to be reaching the stages to be ready to give CCs, who are quite obviously not ready. This is not questioning there honesty, just there compitence

In all cases judges at Crufts have given numerous sets of ticket with high entries

on each occasion they have judged, therefore, in my opinion have earned they special judging appointment at Crufts. As most exhibitors have previously entered under them at other shows, I do not see why they should have to make any special declaration of intent, and in my opinion it is certainly to late for that or any exams - rather like shutting the gate after the horse had bolted.

Off soap box now

Agree with Dessie by the way - all classes whatever they are should be judged to the breed standard.

PS good luck everyone next Saturday.

 

[neave]

To a point i have to agree with Fiona. But i also believe that all judges should be given a fair go, some will make mistakes and learn from those mistakes. Some dont and carry on making those mistakes. Because of the shortage of judges up round my area we sometimes at open shows will get a judge who has no experieces of the breeds they are judging so i sometimes tend to be a bit carefull when i go under them but as i said every one deserves a chance.

Ave got my first judging appointment next month. And some people might think that i dont have enough experince to be judging hounds even though ave been showing for 17 years, but what i would say to them dont judge me until you've been under me, every one deserves at least one chance. Just like exhibitors at shows we pay to enter our dogs and should therefore be given the same equal opportunity as everyone else in the ring.

 

[neave]

Forgot to add thats me off me soap box too (w00t) :thumbsup:

 

[EJW]

Call me cynical but I think it's about time the judges had to qualify for Crufts
It's the amount of 'fixed', 'facey' and downright pathetic judging I've seen on the green carpet that just makes me sad!  (And I'm not talking about just whippets.)

I think all judges should have to swear on the bible that they will honestly judge the dog... and then take a lie detector test afterwards to answer questions about why they chose their winners... then we'd get some entertainment.. put that on telly as a new 'reality show'!!!

These people know who they are and should be aware that most find their behaviour disgusting and pathetic...

Right , off my soapbox now

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:lol: :lol: Good one!!!!!!!! :thumbsup:

 

[JAX]

I give most judges a go , unless its known they have certain `fancies ` or wouldn't have the courage to not place a top breeder/ judge , should they not have the best dog on the day of course .

Crufts judges ( apparently apart from the ones mentioned a while back :- " ) are picked by the kennel Club , They have a list and when you reach the top you are asked to judge , simple as that :cheers:

Of course its up to us who we spend /waste our money on . Nobody forces us to enter under who we dont wish to .

As for non breed judges . as long as we get an honest opinion that's fine with me

 

[~JO~]

As for non breed judges . as long as we get an honest opinion that's fine with me

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With non-breed judges if they at least read the breed standard before entering the ring it would be good I am talking about open shows here mainly. :- "

 

[quintessence]

I'll show under anybody providing they write a report.!!!!!

Jenny

 

[05whippet]

As for non breed judges . as long as we get an honest opinion that's fine with me

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With non-breed judges if they at least read the breed standard before entering the ring it would be good I am talking about open shows here mainly. :- "

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Totally agree Jo :thumbsup: ......seeing dogs go BOB that are blatantly not within the standard makes the Judge, exhibitor & exhibit a laughing stock!!!!!!!!!

 

[neave]

(w00t) (w00t) (w00t)

 

[JAX]

I'll show under anybody providing they write a report.!!!!!
Jenny

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Today i won 2 classes with 2 different dogs and the judge today Steve Hall (Shenedene ) told me not to bother standing my dog for him as hhe dosnt do reports for Open shows (w00t) :rant: . I told him I think its part of his judging contract that he does , but didnt get any responce /. I also mentioned it to the chairman and he thought he should too . I think maybe its only Champ shows they have to , but I still think its very bad form :rant:

 

[neave]

I thought all judges no matter what type of show it is have to write a critque. that was not a nice thing the judge said to you, "i dont do report", perhaps the next time we are at a show and a judge ask us to stand our dogs which should say "i dont do standing." (w00t) (w00t)

 

[~JO~]

I'll show under anybody providing they write a report.!!!!!
Jenny

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Today i won 2 classes with 2 different dogs and the judge today Steve Hall (Shenedene ) told me not to bother standing my dog for him as hhe dosnt do reports for Open shows (w00t) :rant: . I told him I think its part of his judging contract that he does , but didnt get any responce /. I also mentioned it to the chairman and he thought he should too . I think maybe its only Champ shows they have to , but I still think its very bad form :rant:

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That is pretty poor