Desperate for advice

[flump1976]

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Hi everyone, I am new here and to forums in general, so please bare with me, I don't know if I'm posting in the right place either, if it is wrong, please accpet my apologies.

Oh where to start...I have a 10 year old boxer x staffy (Tia) and had been toying with the idea of getting a new puppy for my 15 year old autistic son (Apparently animals are great for kids who are special) he really wanted a pug but unfortunately funds would not stretch that far.

My boyfriends sister's dog (a staffy) was pregnant at the time, so I chose a puppy from her, I'd seen the mum on many occasions and also met the dad, I initially requested the smallest of the litter and a male (a male because I had been told that female staffy's are not keen on other females and because Tia is part staffy I felt it was best to get a male and the smallest because I'm a sucker for the tiny ones) however the smallest was female, I couldnt resisit.

I brought 'Little Bae' home and introduced her to Tia, who was not impressed and initially was a little aggressive, my boyfriend suggested bringing his dog (from the same litter as Bae) into the home to release the pressure from Tia. It worked a treat, Tia went back to being her clam but boistrous self and Bae and Herbie had each other. All was good, until Herbie started showing signs of seperation anxiety (I'd dealt with this with Tia and was no stranger) he destroyed my carpet, dining table and chairs, laminate floor, panelled walls and his beds, you name it he chewed it, and Bae started showing signs of a nervous dog, she craves attention constantly and will flinch at the slightest things.

We got a cage for herbie and on the advice of our vet paid £250 for a dog trainer who in all honesty is absolutely useless, he came once and we havent seen him since, in spite of our pleas for help, everything is done over the phone or via email and that is only when he gets back to us.

The puppies are almost 2 (April) and are still pooping and peeing in the home during the night, even though they know to go out in the garden, or when there out for their walks, they never pee or poop in the home during the day, and even do their business before we go to bed. They are fed on a raw diet, with access to water during the day, I remove the water around 5 in the evening to prevent any accidents, but every morning I'm greated with the foul smell of poop and a few lovely puddles from both of them.

Herbie is still chewing his beds day and night, in spite of having other distractions, on the advice of the dog trainer, when I go out I put toys in his cage for him, a Kong bone, or a stuffed Kong sometimes a regular bone just to distract him from chewing his bed, but he will still have a nibble.

More recently Herbie has showed signs of aggression towards my friends newborn baby, she was in her bouncer in the living room and herbie was in the hall, there is a large dog safety gate on the living room door, he was growling at her and pushing the gate with his nose, when she cried for her bottle, his growl became longer and deeper, and my friend has not been round since. I have explained what happened to my boyfriend but as he was not here to witness it, I dont think he fully believes what happened (if only I'd videoed it) I am 8 months pregnant myself and deeply concerned for our babys safety, as he's nipped at my 10 year old on more than one occasion in the past, but my boyfriend is forever making excuses for Herbies behaviour.

Following a conversation with both our vet and dog trainer, we have been advised to rehome Bae, as according to the trainer a nervous dog can be very unpredictable, so it is with a heavy heart that I have made arrangements to rehome her with my cousin and her family, I know she will be well cared for and will get all the love and attention she needs and deserves, she will even get to sleep on the beds, which she is not allowed to do here lol However my boyfriend will not rehome Herbie, he wants to wait until the baby comes along before he makes a decision.

I am asking for advice on what to do for the best, and also if there is any training advice that you can offer, I love all three of our dogs and don't want to have to rehome any of them, however I know that sometimes this has to be the case (my parents had to rehome their yorkshire terrier when I was born, he didn't like me, and my aunt and uncle had to rehome their collie after she bit my cousin)

I genuinely don't know what to do. Any advice would be greatfully appriciated.

 

[MyGermanShepherd]

Hello! It sounds like you or your boyfriend need to do focused socialization sessions and desensitization sessions. This is a time consuming process as it may take weeks or months between dogs and children. But both types of sessions are important for safety (your dog and beings around it). Especially in a multi-dog home and with children being around requires focused investment of time.

 

[flump1976]

Thank you for your reply.

I am not familiar with focused socialization or desensitization sessions. All 3 dogs are fine with other dogs and people, we've never had a problem until my friend came in with her baby, we put his nipping down to being a puppy and not knowing what was right or wrong and have corrected it.

Unfortunately my boyfriend and I think very differently, I see dogs as family members but they are in fact dogs, and I have rules in place for eg: they are not to jump up and laying on the furniture is a big no no, to name just a few, however my boyfriend see's Herbie as his baby and as such has treated him so, and will often bend the rules when he thinks I am not paying attention. He refers to the dogs as 'Ours' but in reality Herbie is his and Bae and Tia belong to me, I have no say when it comes to Herbie which is annoying. I have expalined that when the baby comes our time is going to be limited, my eldest child who is 15 has special needs, my 10 year old also has additional needs and a newborn on the way, I am worried that we may not be able to give them the time and attention they need and deserve.

I am more than willing to give your suggestions a try however I wouldn't know where to start? so any advice would be great.

The peeing and the pooping in the home at night is a problem, so I got up at 3am and let them out. There was no accidents when I got up again at 5;30, I figured since I will be getting up to do newborns night feeds, I might as well get into some kind of routine.

 

[JoanneF]

A few things come to mind. The first thing I'd suggest is consistency. If you say one thing and your partner says another, neither of you will get the desired result because the dogs simply can't work out what they are meant to do. Regarding toileting Gypsysmum puts loads of good advice on here. I'm mot going to just repeat it, have a search and you'll find it is largely about good practice in taking the dogs out last thing (separately is good) and rewarding toileting outside. You could also consider crate training - dogs don't see a cage, they see a cosy den. Look at 'messing in the house' under New Content or in the Whippet Forum.

The behaviour with your children is obviously a concern, and it's great that you are looking for a solution before a real problem occurs. The last thing anyone wants is for the behaviour to escalate to a bite. Other people who are better qualified than i am to advise on this will hopefully post shortly. But a few thoughts are that if you did go down the route of crate training, the dogs will have a safe place to retreat if the children are stressing them. Children and dogs need to be carefully managed, and while I appreciate your last trainer was not helpful, there are good trainers out there. Look for one who is qualified through COAPE or the APBC. And - this is NOT a solution, it's just a safety net - you could consider a muzzle for the dogs. It won't solve the problem but it will keep the children safe, and ultimately the dogs too because you clearly care very much for them so you don't want them to have to suffer the consequences of biting.

Keep us posted on progress.

 

[gypsysmum]

I agree with the above. A muzzle is a safety precaution. Do not think that a dog knows not to bite. Dogs do not have morals. We have morals because we have a pre frontal cortex as part of our brain. Dogs do not. If they feel unhappy for some reason then they may growl first and bite second. If, however, the growl is not respected, as the warning that it is, they may not growl in future, just bite.

Aggression is an instinctive reaction, not a conscious decision. Write this on your wall!

The only dogs that can be considered reasonably safe around children are ones that met lots of them when they were going through their "critical socialisation period". This occurs from about four to fourteen weeks of age (differs with breeds). They learn, then, that children are not small adults but can be unpredictable, unstable and just plain weird (to a dog). After that socialisation period they find it hard to view children in the same way as they view adults. Dogs that have had bad experiences around children will also not be safe.

To this end you need help to decide what to do. Again, I agree that a behaviourist from either COAPE or the APBC would be an essential move if you want to keep your dogs around children.

Please, please do not think that discipline or punishment will solve the situation. It just drives it underground only to resurface at a later date sometimes with disastrous consequences.

The toilet training could also be covered, along with any other issues, under the same consultation with a behaviourist. I would imagine your previous trainer was out of his depth as you have a very complex situation going on in your house.

I do hope you are able to resolve it.

 

[flump1976]

Hi guys

update:

Saturday morning I came down to a complete mess on the hallway rug, needless to say I was not impressed, on hands and knees scrubbing a rug at 5;30 is not fun as you can imagine. At this point I was 'thats it they have to go' ... following tears and tantrums from my children and my partner, my partner and I had a chat and we are in agreement that a behaviourist is the way to go, none of us want to re-home the pups, I have been in contact with a behaviourist and they require a full report from the vet so all 3 dogs are booked in for saturday afternoon, then we can go ahead. I am hopeful that we can resolve these issues.

While I am here, I need some more advice with regards to spaying, TIa is spayed and Herbie is carstrated, Bae is not, our vet explained that she could be done at 6 months, however she was in season at this time, so we had to wait, he explained that you have to wait a certain period of time after the season is finished before having her done, which is fine, but her seasons are sporadic we never know when she is due or if she will have one at all. Is this normal?

 

[JoanneF]

Glad you are getting in a behaviourist, I really hope it helps. I don't know about Bae's seasons, hopefully Gypsysmum will be along shortly! Nutrition is my area of interest, can I ask what you are feeding?

 

[flump1976]

Oh so do I ... fingers crossed.

They are all fed on a raw diet, tripe and beef mainly as they seem to enjoy that the most.

 

[JoanneF]

No red flags there then. If you'd said Baker's, that would be different lol!

 

[flump1976]

Lol ... No not bakers, heard some nasty stories about that stuff.

Tia's always been on a raw diet, so it just seemed the sensible thing to do

 

[gypsysmum]

Your vet is the best person to advise you about spaying Bae. They will need to know about sporadic seasons in order to help you. The reason behind the rule is that the blood supply to the uterus is greatest during and around a season. This makes the operation much trickier. The safest time is, in a bitch that has seasons every six months, three months after a season. This is when the reproductive organs are at rest.

All sorts of things can affect behaviour and it might be wise to be making as many notes as you can about each dog's behaviour and what seems to influence it. Whenever you notice something that puzzles or concerns you note down what happened before, during and after the incident. This will help the behaviourist to get to the bottom of your problems. Also scan back in your memory for things that happened in the past.

Good luck with the vet's assessment and consultation with the Behaviourist. I am sure you will feel much better once you know what is going on and why.