Dog fearful of man

[Silverpoppy]

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Hi, this is a desperate plea for some advice.

I have had a very nervous dog for over 13 months now.

She is a rescue and very fearful of men. However she actually appears to be fine with men when out on walks and off lead, presumably as she's aware she can escape them if need be.

She will always be a nervous dog with strange people and that's fine.

The problem is that she is very scared of the one man living in the house. This man is very gentle and quiet.

I'm struggling to know what to do to help her overcome this fear. She will injure herself trying to get away from him, she can't relax in the house or garden as she's always on high alert, she has even wet her bed or the floor several times in what I can only presume is fear. She is 4 years old and fully house trained, never having had accidents in her previous home with one lady owner (she had to rehome her due to travelling abroad, she had her for over 3 years as a rescue).

She is not at all food oriented so I have no apparent way of training her out of this fear. All advice I've had so far is treat based and she won't take treats. She won't take anything no matter how tasty so I'm stuck.

Any ideas what i do next?

Thanks in advance

 

[gypsysmum2]

First and foremost is a vet check (with a female vet!) just to rule out any underlying problems.

Next I would take all pressure off her. Give her a bolt hole that she can access at all times and let her use it whenever she needs to. Advise the male in the house that they are, under no circumstances, to approach her or even make eye contact. They must just wait and wait and wait again for her to make the first move. Every time he approaches her it confirms her fears that he is chasing her.

This is not unknown in dogs that are born into an all female household and homed into an all female household. It is not necessarily because the dog has been abused by a male. They just do not recognise men as "safe" to be around. This all occurs during the socialisation period up to 12/14 weeks. It is vital that puppies are exposed to all the things they are likely to meet later in life.

As this is such a severe case I would recommend help from a Qualified Pet Behaviour Therapist from either COAPE or APBC. One of the directors of COAPE, Val Strong, has developed a diet that lifts the serotonin levels in the brain of dogs and so helps them to cope in stressful situations. It gives you a window in which to work with your dog. One of the COAPE diplomats will be able to prescribe it if they think it will help in this case.

 

[Silverpoppy]

Thank you for your reply.

She is absolutely fine health wise. Previous owner was in fact a vet and she's recently had her boosters and a full check up (with a lady vet!) and not a thing wrong with her.

She has a safe place in the house she will stay in all day and the man has minimal contact with her.

The problem with getting a behaviourist in is that this dog is a family dog and not fully mine to make decisions about and no one is very receptive to the idea of doing so. Plus the cost is a factor I'm afraid.

I'm really hoping for any strategies I can try with her for starters, maybe someone has been in this situation and has some success stories.

Thanks again for your advice, I'm not trying to be difficult and disregard it but my reality is getting professional help is just not feasible at the moment but I'm working on it!

 

[JoanneF]

Check your insurance policy if she is insured; some cover the cost of behaviouists. And can I add, you describe the issue very articulately and logically, I hope you can find the right way to express it so persuasively to your family.

 

[Silverpoppy]

Thank you for your lovely words Joanne.

Unfortunately she is not insured. I also wasn't aware some cover the cost of a behaviourist so that's brilliant information thank you.

I'm doing all I can think of to help her but feel very much alone in this at the moment. She is currently settled on her bed with the man sat in the room so I feel there is hope. If I dare move from the room though she'll take the opportunity to run back to her safe place.

 

[gypsysmum2]

You are right that the wetting of the bed/floor is caused by anxiety. The dog seeks relief from all the anxiety it is feeling and remembers the feeling of "relief" that comes from urinating so gives that a try. Not a conscious decision just the body seeking relief from stress.

Because she is on such a high state of alert she cannot eat treats. Her body is in the "fight/flight" mode and this causes all other functions, that might slow her up, to shut down. It can be a good test of how anxious a dog is if it will eat a tasty treat or not.

The worst thing the man in the house can do is to try to win her over. She will not see his looks and approaches, no matter how well meant, as friendly. They are all just "threatening" to her. If he could regard her as a wild animal that might help him to understand her emotions. We would not invade the space of, say, a fox that had been shut in the house with us. We would just move around slowly and be very, very careful not make her feel trapped in any way. We would leave escape routes open and let her use them whenever she felt the need. Then we would just wait and wait and wait for her to come to terms with our presence.

Only when she is relaxed enough can any learning take place. Write this on the wall "Anxiety prevents learning". She cannot learn that man is no threat to her while she is anxious. The more relaxed she is the more learning will take place. Organise her life so that she feels relaxed and she will be able to learn.

Other things you can do is to try to find things that she naturally enjoys. Chewing is a good stress buster. Try to find things that she enjoys chewing. You don't say what breed she is but it helps dogs if they can perform things that are natural to their breed. Fetching for a Labrador, digging for a terrier, chasing for a sight hound etc.

Just as they cannot eat if they are in "fear" mode, it sometimes works in our favour if we can get them to eat something. The body is fooled into thinking that it is cannot be fearful if it is eating! It might be worth trying really, really tasty treats to see if you can persuade her (without any pressure of any kind) to eat a treat when she is showing a tiny bit if bravery such as being in the same room as the man.

Keep eye contact to a minimum, it is very threatening to dogs. Expect three steps back for every step forward. Think in terms of months and years rather than days and weeks of progress. Fear memories will surface every now and again even when you thought she had forgotten them.

Hope you make some progress with her and well done for seeking help.

 

[gypsysmum2]

Just had a reminder on my Facebook feed that there is a website called Fearfuldogs.com. Might be worth a look?

 

[Silverpoppy]

Thank you so much for taking the time to write all that down for me. That is extremely helpful advice and gives me somewhere to start.

She is a lurcher and has lots of opportunity to indulge in chasing (poor wild bunnies!). She really is a different dog when out and off her lead. So free and happy. That is partly what makes me so sad for her as I know how she can be yet she's so full of fear at home.

Having said that she did so well yesterday. I'm trying to establish a new safe place for her more integrated in family life. She managed really well and actually took treats of cheese and had a short snooze. From what you have said I think I can take that as an excellent sign.

I'm so grateful you have both taken the time to respond to me. I feel I have some hope now of moving her past this. I will look at that website, thank you.

 

[JoanneF]

I don't know (maybe Gypsysmum does) if a Thundershirt might help?

 

[gypsysmum2]

Brilliant news about the progress she is making

There is some discussion about whether Thundershirts work or just suppress the problem??? My own feeling is that some dogs like a hug (the shirt is a snug fit around the dog) and some dogs hate it.

Adaptil is worth trying. You can get it on line or in good pet shops. Make sure her bolt hole is where that she would choose so that she can relax fully. Plug the Adaptil in nearby.

Rescue Remedy (Bach Flower Remedies) also has some fans. You can put a few drops in her water bowl.

I have also sent you a pm.

 

[JoanneF]

Bach rescue remedy has a pet version if that helps.

 

[Silverpoppy]

Thank you both. I actually have already tried adaptil as it was suggested as worth a try by the vet. It's had no effect unfortunately.

I've had a look at the thundershirt. I'm a bit sceptical but I'll keep it in mind.

She also doesn't drink much water so I don't think she'll get much of a dose of the rescue remedy. She really is very difficult!

 

[JoanneF]

You can give rescue remedy with a treat. Would she take it on a spoonful of yoghurt?

 

[Silverpoppy]

I've not tried her with yoghurt, can give it a go.

 

[dogmatize]

I would recommend trying skullcap and Valerian tablets from "Dorwest". Maybe an adaptil collar would help too

 

[JoanneF]

If you use yoghurt, try to use a low fat, natural, live yoghurt.

 

[TashaBellDog]

We have a solution! Channel 4 are teaming up with an expert in canine management who can deal with any problem, any size, any dog! Invaluable coaching without the expense.

If you think we can help, e-mail dogs@libertybell.tv or call us on 0207 598 7258.

Thanks,
Tash

 

[JoanneF]

I'm sorry to sound cynical but the long, slow process of supporting a troubled dog isn't the sort of thing that generally makes entertaining tv. Before even responding I would want to know exactly how you would prepare this for broadcast, who your trainer is, and what his credentials and methods are.

 

[Seelsy]

Hi. I read this post and replies with interest. My son have a home to a rescue Lurcher about 4 months ago. He is absolutely adorable and incredibly affectionate with him and women in general. He seems to have taken a shine to me and when I visit he is playful and very gentle. The problem is that he really isn't keen on men apart from my son. My eldest son who has visited a few times and been met with teeth showing and growling. Apparently the man who abused and neglected him was of similar stature to my eldest son so we can all understand the anxiety and fear that must be causing that. My husband has had two visits and once was fine,the other not so much. The dog was curious and although a bit nervous was playing happily with his toys on the floor with my husband for a fair while. On the way out though he nipped my husband on his leg. My husband being a nice guy basically assured my son it was fine but that it must be watched as it could be a problem. He was aware that he may have startled the dog on getting up to leave and doesn't blame the dog at all. It is however a concern and my son is quite worried about this as it appears whenever they go for a walk he is constantly growling and barking at men. Women he is absolutely fine with and so the worst thing I've dealt with his is constant licking and wanting to snuggle.lol. He is around a year and a half old. I will give my son huge credit. He is training him very well. His dad and step mum go to Crufts and have several animals including Lurchers. Instantly he took my son (who is tall but very thin..not big build like the aggressor) and he has no issues with anything. He tells him when he needs to go outside ,even from the first day. He is so attached to him though that he won't eat in the kitchen where his bowl is,he takes mouthfuls and brings it into where my son is and eats. He hates being alone and ends up on my sons bed. My son adores him.

I think I'm just concerned about the anxious nipping and teeth baring where men are concerned. My eldest son and husband walk in say hello to him in a calm voice,then ignore him and see if he comes to them. He usually does but there is always that worry that he may snap. I believe he is a Lurcher crossed with a Collie and I've heard Collies can be quite particular too.

Taking him for walks is an ordeal. He is always kept on the lead because of the concern over biting. He wants to chase everything which I know is natural for this breed. My son lives very close to a huge natural park. He walks him there all the time. He would love to be able to allow him some more freedom but is obviously worried about letting him off leash. Someone suggested he get a muzzle so that it would prevent him accidentally or on purpose nipping someone. He doesn't seem to know if this is a good or bad idea. He worries it will make him worse and doesn't like the idea the dog will feel 'muzzled' but agrees it would make him less worried when he takes him anywhere.

It's such a shame as he honestly is the most adorable,affectionate dog around me,my son and his girlfriend. However ,my husband ,my sons dad and my other son have all been on the receiving end of his not so affectionate side.

Anyway,this brings me to my next thing. My son has been invited to an event. His girlfriend will be away. We have been asked to doggysit. Now,we are both fine about having him and it's only for 3 nights BUT I am concerned about a few things.

-Given his anxiety and likelihood of his separation anxiety from my son ,is this wise?

-Having already nipped my husband,is this likely to happen again ,given that he will be in our home this time rather than his?

-I have already said ,if we were to say yes,we must consider the dogs needs before our own and be certain this won't make him ill. Plus if we have him,my son must be prepared to come back if the dog is truly stressed. How do we best help the dog settle and cope with being away from my son?

Considerations also are that I'm not exactly a well woman with Fibromyalgia and arthritis so any dog walking will be down to my husband. Also that at home he sleeps with them. Here he cannot do that.

I am at home all day. My husband is at work. I'm concerned also how he will react when my husband comes home. How do we manage that? Is it just a case of him coming in slowly and ignoring him and letting him come to him if he wants?

I'm sorry for the rambling and questions but I only want to make sure we are all doing the right thing by the dog. ( I have referred to him as dog so as not to mention his name ,not because he is actually called dog..lol).

Thanks in advance.

 

[gypsysmum2]

Hope we have helped you on your own thread Seelsy?