English Breed Standard

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I seem to have lost my copy of the U.K. whippet standard.  I wonder if someone could direct me to a site where I might print it, or if someone could send it to me by email?

I would very much appreciate it.  

 

[dawn]

Hi Samantha

We had lost this address or would have gotten back to you sooner.

WE do not have the standard on our site as we refuse to pay the kennel clubs inflated demands of  requiring 40 pounds for the 'privilege' As if they dont take enough money off us exhibitors.

The address is http://home.bip.net/belara/standeng.html hope this is OK otherwise email us and we will send a copy seperately.

 

Hi Dawn,

Thanks so much for the URL, its difficult to find the U.K. standard for some reason.  What's this charge for posting it on your site?  Seems very unreasonable, but we best not let the Canadian Kennel Club know about it or they will be charging us too!  Intersting thread on size in the racing section, can you tell me sizes on your dogs now (what you are showing etc.).  Also, do you feel that an International standard should be drawn up, especially considering how "small" the world is getting, what with import/export, and of course, the internet and international judging.  

 

[dawn]

Samantha

Weve sent you another version of the UKKC standard which was published in Phil Moran-Healy's book. BTW it is worth reading IF you can get hold of a copy. If you want The Illustrated Standard I will try to get hold of a copy and send the hard copy over to you.

Size is a contentious issue as you are well aware. Our thoughts are that a large dog that carries itself well and is otherwise a good example of the breed should not be over penalised due to size. Nor a small dog etc. There is no absolute size set so it is for the individual judge to compare what is in the class and judge what is there. Our dogs do exceed the 'standard' standard but within the ring are not large in comparison with the other exhibits. The problem is when all the class is 20inch and yours is 18 it is yours that looks small and not the others that look big. What the answer is I do not know but as Richard was involved some years ago when the KC started updating all the standards and it was difficult within committee to reach agreement, and the Whippet Breed Council is the responsible organ for change and that is made up af representatives from all the UK clubs, I doubt that an international standard is a realistic option for a good few years yet. Where conflict is inevitable is where we invite a Mexican judge, for example, who judges to their standard rather than the UK standard.

Should international judges judge to the standard of their home country or that of the host country and does that cause problems with the use of language as words mean different things in different countries never mind translations being altered?

 

Hello Dawn,

I agree with you that if yours is of standard size and the others are all large, you'll end up looking as if you have a runt.  And yes, the problem is when international judges, judge to their own country's standard and not the country they are in.  I personally feel that since an International Standard will be a long time coming, it is absolutely necessary for international judges to judge to the standard of the country they are in.  The AWC holds a judges study group throughout the week of the National and I did notice last year a number of forgein judges in the group.  I am very interested in size in the U.K. , would love to bring home a nice little bitch or dog next year.  What would you say is the approximate size of the largest and smallest you've seen?  More importantly, would you say there are still a number of kennels breeding to size?  Oh, I did see one of the "greyhound" like whippets last year - complete with flat back and heavy bone!  I too thought it was a Jr. Puppy greyhound - again, until it entered the whippet ring!  It was in a large class and it really was evident and fortunately left the ring empty handed.

 

[Nigel]

We are lucky enough to have a first edition copy of 'The Whippet and Race Dog' by Freeman Lloyd published in 1894 (I think this was the first ever Whippet book published). In the section about racing and handicaping there is a chart giving handicap marks for different weight dogs - the chart goes from 9lbs to 28lbs!

Pedigree racing now has a minimum weight of 14lbs, but can you imagine how small a 9 pounder would have been....

 

Hi Nigel,

what a fascinating book to have!  I would think that at 9 pounds it would seem more like an Italian Greyhound than a whippet, but perhaps at that time the "terrier blood" was influencing size?  I do recall a photo of Stanley Wilkins with some of the Tiptree dogs and they did seem very small in the photo.  Still looking forward to Judy's explanation of straight rear angulation as it is obviously what is desired in a racing whippet on both sides of the Atlantic.

 

[stephen mason]

Well, I would like to add my grain of sand. If a Mexican, French, German, Peruvian(?) judge etc were  invited to judge in Spain he/she would use the now existing International Standard which of course is the FCI standard which is the K.C. standard with a little more height according to Patsy Gilmour. As I understand the FCI standards are, unlike the U.S, the standards of the country  origin. So the FCI   rottweiller standard is the German standard. The Mexican judging in Britain could use the K.C. standard as somethig like 0.50 cms in height is the only difference. The U.S. of course has changed the standards of the country of origin and now we have the American Akita and the Japaese Akita. I believe that the FCI correctly uses the Japanese or do we have two different breeds?. The U.S. have also produced the America Staffordshire, cocker,foxhound etc.. I understand that the Americans have a tendancy to exaggerate the original specimen ,being taller,longer necks, longer coats in the case of Irish setters and possibly whippets, more glamorous and showier with I have read in various places straighter shoulders and exaggerated hind angulations. As I said before they are entitled to do this and produce the american whippet ,what have you. It is interesting to observe that the U.K., U.S.A, Canada, New Zealand(?) and most English speaking countries are not members of the FCI ( must be some connection with the € euro here). Gibratar is a member of the FCI. Of course with our FCI International Stadard which is the K.C. standard we have the problem of interpretation. I notice that the " judges should use their discretion and unduly penalise an otherwise good specimen" has been deleted from the K.C. standard when referring to height. Many  Europeans do not understand the British attitude to height. In 1990 our Nevedith based imported dog was said by Piero Renai della Rena ( well known Italian judge) to be too tall at 20 inches. This dog became a Spanish champion under British, U.S.and Canadian judges. For most Europeans whose law is based on the "Napoleonic Code" as opposed to English law ( the law of equity) 51 cms is 51 cms and that´s that. The Scandanavian attitude is more lenient. This is getting a bit long winded so I´ll stop. Hope I´mnot boring you all. Being retired I have all the time in the world. Stephen Mason. Madrid.

 

[Henrik Harling]

Stephen Mason wrote:

Well, I would like to add my grain of sand. If a Mexican, French, German, Peruvian(?) judge etc were  invited to judge in Spain he/she would use the now existing International Standard which of course is the FCI standard which is the K.C. standard with a little more height according to Patsy Gilmour.

In Sweden we use the FCI standard wich is a direct translation of the english standard and there is not more height allowed.

Stephen Mason wrote:

I notice that the " judges should use their discretion and unduly penalise an otherwise good specimen" has been deleted from the K.C. standard when referring to height. Many  Europeans do not understand the British attitude to height. In 1990 our Nevedith based imported dog was said by Piero Renai della Rena ( well known Italian judge) to be too tall at 20 inches. This dog became a Spanish champion under British, U.S.and Canadian judges. For most Europeans whose law is based on the "Napoleonic Code" as opposed to English law ( the law of equity) 51 cms is 51 cms and that´s that. The Scandanavian attitude is more lenient. This is getting a bit long winded so I´ll stop. Hope I´mnot boring you all. Being retired I have all the time in the world. Stephen Mason. Madrid.

Some of the biggest whippets I have seen in a show ring that even were champions was i England.

I just joined this discussion group so I hope that you don´t mind me bringing up an old thread.

Henrik Härling, Sweden