fighters

[ricky]

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i would just like to ask WHY OH WHY do people insist on running dogs which are known to be fighters and interfear with other dogs in thier race. As a result in this happening at the derby weekend my dog i.e SLIPPER is unable to run for 2weeks as a dog named KESTRAL FLYER which has known to fight across the country was allowed to run and subsequently lamed 2 dogs in the same race the other been MASIA. has anybody else got an opion on this matter as i personally dont like the vet bills.

ricky

 

[debbie]

:rant:

i totally agree with you ricky as last year at a stockton open i was running a dog called maddas and this same said dog KESTRAL FLYER did the same said thing but thankfully my dog was not injured

debbie

 

[kipper fluke]

Well Rick, maybe if your dog had been in the appropriate weight class this wouldn't have happened, lame due to the Kestral flyer?? I personally seriously question that statement. Very unfair and also infactual.

The dog is not a known fighter!! He's only 18 month old and has only attended 4 opens-and runs quite well at Lancaster club.

Some reputation your giving the young dog eh?

The owners of the dog (it is their first dog) have been in the sport 5 minutes but at least they get their dog in the correct class.

Probably after reading this they won't be in for much longer,as the weekend really upset them or should I say the reception from some fellow racers and negative verbal abuse.

Very sad I think.

As for Debbies comments-whilst stood at the traps-how many actual races have you seen this dog run in? to shout out loud on the track-'It always does that'

when the most you could possibly have seen it run is 4 times.

It ran 4 times at the weekend at Aycliffe at interferred once only.

Steve

 

[debbie]

right steve as to the dog not fighting yes it does at the bend champs also at askern. where ever i have seen this dog it as ran for the other dogs and not the lure and i know for a fact this dog is barred from west hougton track for the same said thing. as for slipper she was in her correct class the said day 4olb as this bitch wieghs 37lb. I YOU SAYING STEVE THAT THIS DOG DID NOT INTERFERE WITH THE DOGS IN THIS RACE IF SO WHY DID IT GET DISQUALIFIED AND THE RACE RE-RUN

DEBBIE

 

[kipper fluke]

I would think what i have said is clear enough for all those who read it .

I would also question the barring from Westhoughton .

I think also that Chris and Paul may have a different view as to whether 'Slipper' was in the correct class or not as i believe there were a number of complaints.

If you get things right all the time then you can criticise others.

Not many including myself do, but to treat new people to the sport who are both very caring and enthusiastic in this manner is not at all fair, in my opinion they need helping not slagging! you on the other hand may think differently but then that is your choice. a little compassion goes a long way!

 

[jade scott]

i dont think we can dispute that unfortunately kestral flyer did interfer in the cons race at the derby but in it defence i have seen it run clean races in the past and this was the first time i had seen it fight on the track i know it can get a bit firey with other dogs but not on the track, i also think that the owners would not have intended their dog to interfer or injure anybody elses dogs, and maybe some help and clues as to stop it happeneing wouldnt go a miss just my opinion though i dont race in its class or with it every open

 

[kipper fluke]

May I add that the dog has never run at any championships as the owners decided that he wasn't ready and would never run him if they thought either he or any other dog would get hurt-they are not that sort to risk either party being injured.

 

[Vicky]

I don't really know what to say here, apart from i'm taking no sides

The dog is obviously not an out & out fighter as i have seen him run clean races in the past - in saying that he does have a problem, but having not had a dog like this myself i don't know what to suggest. Sad thing is, it's a vicious circle, the dog needs to run against other dogs to get clean & unfortunately people will now refuse to run against him.

I agree with Jade though, the family need some help, i'm sure he'll straighten himself out at some point, there's a few dogs that have fought at our club but are now straight (one with a rch title & r-up supreme), if people had refused to run with them they'd never have got straight.

Hope the family get the help they need (last thing we need is newcomers walking out of the sport) & i hope the two injured dogs recover quickly.

 

[Tony Taylor]

Slipper is clearly a "40lb" class dog and so the 40lb class race was it's appropiate class; Or would have been if it wasn't for the fact that the race in question was a consolation race for the main Derby event in which Slipper had entered the No Limit race, no doubt to avoid Show Three. Slipper should therefore have been made to run in the No Limit consolation. Complaints would have been made if Slipper had won but it didn't so all this doesn't matter and has no relevance to the tackling that occurred. Without Slipper, Kestral Flyer would still have been disqualified.

Slipper wasn't the only dog in the race and wasn't the only dog interfered with. Considering the Kestral Flyer was in orange it did well to interfere with white and blue, pushing blue into the netting. At the end of the race Kestral Flyer ignored the lure to attack my dog.

The dog does have a history of tackling.

It is barred from the races at Westhoughton.

Since this is a dog bred by Steve Boyd he's obviously defensive and not unbiased but IMO the dog shouldn't run until it grows up, which with correct training is quite possible, and stops interfering with other racers.

 

[kipper fluke]

Indeed, Colin and Alison Armstrong/Porky and Joe Winter (Indian Ink) were all very helpful in their 'blinker' design advice and susequent trial using one of my dogs- (Time) to run with him after the racing had finished, he ran perfectly for everyone to see, straight up the middle of the track passing her and going on to the lure.

 

[Tony Taylor]

Indeed, Colin and Alison Armstrong/Porky and Joe Winter (Indian Ink) were all very helpful in their 'blinker' design advice and susequent trial using one of my dogs- (Time) to run with him after the racing had finished, he ran perfectly for everyone to see, straight up the middle of the track passing her and going on to the lure.

You recolection of the subsequent "trial" differs from mine.

 

[Scott Frodsham]

    i would just like to ask WHY OH WHY do people insist on running dogs which are known to be fighters and interfear with other dogs in thier race. As a result in this happening at the derby weekend my dog i.e SLIPPER is unable to run for 2weeks as a dog named KESTRAL FLYER which has known to fight across the country was allowed to run and subsequently lamed 2 dogs in the same race the other been MASIA.  has anybody else got an opion on this matter as i personally dont like the vet bills.

                    ricky

Interesting to see that the non peds have similar problems to some of the peds!

Fighting dogs and moaners. Do you honestly think people take any satisfaction from a dog that fights ? I can assure you that they are embaressed!

I'm not associated to anybody concerned but agree that people need help rather than a slagging off on the internet!

Regards,

Scott.

 

[rowland]

QUOTE, (IF YOUR DOG WAS IN THE APPROPRIATE WEIGHT CLASS THIS WOULDN'T HAVE HAPPENED )

WELL THATS NOT VERY COMPASSIONATE ABOUT AN INJURED DOG,

IF THE DOG IS INTERFERING, AND I'AM NOT SAYING IT IS, I NEVER SAW IT RACE AT THE WEEKEND, THEN I'AM SURE PEOPLE WILL HELP THE OWNERS, WE HAVE ALL BEEN THERE ?? BUT IT SHOULD NOT OPEN RACE IF IT IS INTERFERING,

CLUB RUN HIM

 

[kipper fluke]

Tony-the relevance is in my opinion the 'kettle- calling the pan'

Yes- I did breed the dog and am not defending the dog in its actions in this particular race, rather the people that own it who did not deserve this sort of treatment.

The dog will and is getting help-no doubt about that. If the couple are still interested after this.

I would still question the 'barring' being referred to-

Mick certainly did not use those words to the couple at Westhoughton.

Are there any positive suggestions from anyone? on how to further help this problem?

 

[Vicky]

susequent trial using one of my dogs- (Time) to run with him after the racing had finished, he ran perfectly for everyone to see

I didn't see this but is this because he knows time?

I agree with Rowland that the dog should be trailled / club raced but i guess the owners are in no hurry to open race again anyway.

Are there any positive suggestions from anyone? on how to further help this problem?

I have a big built 40lber who's big enough to take a bit of knocking, i'm happy for him to trial with said dog, whether the family choose to accept my offer is entirely up to them.

At the end of the race Kestral Flyer ignored the lure to attack my dog.

Honestly - you know as well as i do that Kestrel Flyer isn't the only dog to do this.

 

[Scott Frodsham]

Could solo it for a while, try blinkers ?

Get it out on live stuff ?

Scott.

 

[kipper fluke]

Tony?? the trial afterwards? how did your recollection differ to ours.?

Our version was supported by Colin on the traps and others on the track.

 

[Tony Taylor]

Eddie ( Stormcloud) was returned to us as a fighter. Legs and Lips was condemmed as a fighter. Neither dog has looked at another dog since "retraining".

Success with the above was acheived by solo runs at the lure and encouragement to play with the lure. When the dog is clearly chasing the lure and picking it up at the end the "fighter" is run up with a dog it can easily pass and beat - preferably passing the stooge dog in the first half of the race. If it can pass without fighting then club race.

The fighter should not be raced against dogs it can't beat or open raced until it is proven. If the dog thinks it can't pass it resorts to fighting. Which is how Stormcloud and Legs and Lips got their undeserved reputation.

 

[kipper fluke]

Thankyou for that information Tony I will pass it on to the owners.

No doubt they will sadly have a look at what has been said tomorrow,they might take some comfort in the fact that it is not only theirs thats having teething troubles.More positive remarks and we might get it sorted.

 

[kipper fluke]

Cheers Scott- that was the sort of response i had hoped for :cheers: