'Look at me'

[doggie1]

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As some of you may be aware, I am making inroads into Eddi's nuttiness and seeing some positive results from training. The one thing I cannot really get him to do is 'look at me' and this could be one that really gets through to him when he's being reactive. I've done everything I've read on CARE, but he will not look at me. I sometimes get a vague head movement, but not eye contact. The only time I get a good response is when I'm giving him his dinner, otherwise - talk to the paw.

I can't get him to lie down either. He will sit, but if you do the treat on his snout and move it back, he just jumps up to get it. He will also jump up when I do the treat going down to the floor. Why bother with all of the sitting, lying down malarkey when you can just as easily get the goods by jumping up?

 

[JudyN]

Does he ever give you eye contact when you're not training, such as when you're petting him? If so, you could encourage that, by saying 'watch!' and giving him a small treat. I'd also ask for it before putting his meal down if he'll do it then - it's all part of showing that eye contact with you is a good thing.

Do you move the treat towards your eyes when asking for a watch? If not, and if his eyes follow the treat, you could say 'watch' when it's right in front of your eyes. Another method I've heard is to stand in front of you with your arms outstretched and a treat in each hand. This means that a glance at your eyes/face will be far more obvious, both to you and him.

For teaching 'down': you say you 'do the treat on his snout and move it back' which doesn't sound quite right to me - I would move the treat down to the floor and cover it with my hand. I think also you need to hold onto the treat a bit more tightly, so he can't snatch it - if he tries to snatch it, I'd walk away, giving him a quick timeout. If it's stinky enough, Eddi will know it's in your hand even if you have your fist closed round it.

One thing I did with Jasper was to hold a treat in my fist, let him try to get it, but only release it the moment he drew back a little, so wasn't touching (chewing!) my hand any more. He learnt that the way to get the treat was by not trying to get it. I had to abandon teaching this when he was very young because my hand was turning to pulp, but once he was a bit more mature he picked it up quickly.

 

[doggie1]

Does he ever give you eye contact when you're not training, such as when you're petting him? If so, you could encourage that, by saying 'watch!' and giving him a small treat. I'd also ask for it before putting his meal down if he'll do it then - it's all part of showing that eye contact with you is a good thing.

Do you move the treat towards your eyes when asking for a watch? If not, and if his eyes follow the treat, you could say 'watch' when it's right in front of your eyes. Another method I've heard is to stand in front of you with your arms outstretched and a treat in each hand. This means that a glance at your eyes/face will be far more obvious, both to you and him.

For teaching 'down': you say you 'do the treat on his snout and move it back' which doesn't sound quite right to me - I would move the treat down to the floor and cover it with my hand. I think also you need to hold onto the treat a bit more tightly, so he can't snatch it - if he tries to snatch it, I'd walk away, giving him a quick timeout. If it's stinky enough, Eddi will know it's in your hand even if you have your fist closed round it.

One thing I did with Jasper was to hold a treat in my fist, let him try to get it, but only release it the moment he drew back a little, so wasn't touching (chewing!) my hand any more. He learnt that the way to get the treat was by not trying to get it. I had to abandon teaching this when he was very young because my hand was turning to pulp, but once he was a bit more mature he picked it up quickly.

I put the treat right in front of my eyes and he won't look, it's all beneath him lol. I do that for sit and he jumps up. He doesn't snatch it from me, he just jumps us when I try 'down' as he does when i try 'sit'

 

[Caro Perry]

Harri was slow to learn down too but a behaviourist told me to try sitting on the floor with my feet on the ground but my knees slightly elevated. You then use the treat to lure them under your knees. As there isn't much space they have to go "down"! Harri got the idea pretty immediately from this.

 

[JudyN]

I wonder if you could 'catch' the behaviours, and whether clicker training would help? So keep your clicker on you, in a pocket, and when you see him sit or lie down, click and treat the moment his bum/chest hit the ground.

 

[doggie1]

Harri was slow to learn down too but a behaviourist told me to try sitting on the floor with my feet on the ground but my knees slightly elevated. You then use the treat to lure them under your knees. As there isn't much space they have to go "down"! Harri got the idea pretty immediately from this.

Sounds worth a try.

 

[doggie1]

I wonder if you could 'catch' the behaviours, and whether clicker training would help? So keep your clicker on you, in a pocket, and when you see him sit or lie down, click and treat the moment his bum/chest hit the ground.

He does respond to the clicker. Catch me being good - I like it.

 

[JoanneF]

I wonder if you could 'catch' the behaviours, and whether clicker training would help? So keep your clicker on you, in a pocket, and when you see him sit or lie down, click and treat the moment his bum/chest hit the ground.

I am a relatively recent convert to clickers and before I got to Judy's post, this was exactly what I was thinking. If your timing with the clicker is good, it won't take him long because he is a smart little guy.

 

[doggie1]

I am a relatively recent convert to clickers and before I got to Judy's post, this was exactly what I was thinking. If your timing with the clicker is good, it won't take him long because he is a smart little guy.

He's selective smart, as in 'what's in it for me' attitude. I'm sure he won't look at me because he knows I'll have the upper hand if he does.

 

[JoanneF]

Timber is also a 'what's in it for me' dog but the easy thing about him is I know now exactly what reward to give - food. He 'earns' his lunch, and that adds value to it too. Once you find what his motivator is, your progress will go much faster. Unfortunately that's the tough part - working out what reward he will value. Since he has a massive prey drive, an on cue chase might do it BUT that is NOT about letting him go off and hunt down other animals etc. - it's above my pay grade to teach and has to be done in a very, very controlled environment; however a decent substitute would be the flirt pole. How would he do if the flirt pole got used only as a reward for, say, watching you? You could use it like you often see the football and agility dogs getting their tuggy toy at the end of their round.

 

[doggie1]

Timber is also a 'what's in it for me' dog but the easy thing about him is I know now exactly what reward to give - food. He 'earns' his lunch, and that adds value to it too. Once you find what his motivator is, your progress will go much faster. Unfortunately that's the tough part - working out what reward he will value. Since he has a massive prey drive, an on cue chase might do it BUT that is NOT about letting him go off and hunt down other animals etc. - it's above my pay grade to teach and has to be done in a very, very controlled environment; however a decent substitute would be the flirt pole. How would he do if the flirt pole got used only as a reward for, say, watching you? You could use it like you often see the football and agility dogs getting their tuggy toy at the end of their round.

I haven't managed to get him a flirt pole yet, it could work though. Trouble with Eddi, he wants to chew everything. I play tuggy with him and I have to keep the toy as a special treat, he wants it off me so he can chew it to death. He will be like that with a flirt pole, but at least we'll get to play.

 

[JudyN]

He's selective smart, as in 'what's in it for me' attitude. I'm sure he won't look at me because he knows I'll have the upper hand if he does.

Look at it from the other angle - you want him to look at you BECAUSE there's something in it for him. You sort of want him to think that he's manipulating you. 'Haha, the sucker, all I have to do is look in his eyes and the fool gives me a treat.'

This is why, when Jasper hears OH coming to the front room, he'll get on the sofa. OH comes in, sees J, sighs, goes to get a treat, and J gets off the sofa for his reward for getting off the sofa.

With clicker training, you can't just click & treat a behaviour straight off. I'm very rusty on it now, but you start of simply clicking and treating repeatedly until the sound of the click is enough to get him drooling all on its own.

And just looking at you won't fix reactivity. He will still have to want to do what you ask, and be calm enough to do what you ask. Which is always going to be difficult if he's always encountering triggers at close range.

 

[doggie1]

Look at it from the other angle - you want him to look at you BECAUSE there's something in it for him. You sort of want him to think that he's manipulating you. 'Haha, the sucker, all I have to do is look in his eyes and the fool gives me a treat.'

This is why, when Jasper hears OH coming to the front room, he'll get on the sofa. OH comes in, sees J, sighs, goes to get a treat, and J gets off the sofa for his reward for getting off the sofa.

With clicker training, you can't just click & treat a behaviour straight off. I'm very rusty on it now, but you start of simply clicking and treating repeatedly until the sound of the click is enough to get him drooling all on its own.

And just looking at you won't fix reactivity. He will still have to want to do what you ask, and be calm enough to do what you ask. Which is always going to be difficult if he's always encountering triggers at close range.

If I can manage to get him to look at me, he might see more of a treat than the dog he wants to bark at. I see those pigs flying again. Seriously, if I can get him to look at me, it will deepen our relationship.

 

[doggie1]

Eddi is in the dog house, he bit the OH.

 

[JudyN]

Eddi is in the dog house, he bit the OH.

Noooo! How did it happen?

 

[doggie1]

Noooo! How did it happen?

I'm heartbroken

 

[JudyN]

(((Hugs))) There are a lot of owners who have been bitten by their dogs (me included) but have been able to learn from it, manage it so it doesn't happen again, and still have a great bond with their dog.

You're in shock now - I felt sick when Jasper bit OH quite badly - but hopefully we'll be able to help you understand what happened and how to move forward. I hope OH isn't too badly hurt.

 

[doggie1]

He won't be able to stay with us now.

 

[JoanneF]

Eddi is in the dog house, he bit the OH.

Oh, no: what happened?

 

[arealhuman]

He won't be able to stay with us now.

Oh my goodness. I hope your OH wasn't too badly hurt. The circumstances leading to the bite will be important - was he aggravated (not necessarily by your partner), scared, or was food being taken from him? I do hope you can recover from this. I was going to post some tips for "down" and "look at me" that worked for us, but will hold off until you've posted back.