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Looking For An Ig Puppy

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lenk said:
Now, I'm getting worried listening to leg break horror stories. My new pup is coming home later in the week.
Jan: How do you tell if the dog has meningitis?
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Hi Lenk, they cant seem to move their neck without screaming. The pain is in the spinal column. Very high temperature. It isnt hereditory but I have heard of quite a few.

The breeder of your pup should have indicated if they hvae a leg break problem in their line, Did you ask them if they have experienced any leg breaks and if there is any Epilepsy in the lines?

Two good questions to ask before buying any Iggie puppy.
 
thanks Jan. Yup, I did ask those questions, and got satisfactory answers.

zez: I think I'll go £12k cover too, was going to go for £7k. Its crazy expensive for a London postcode.
 
Get as much cover as you can afford! Am i allowed to recommend a company here? I've been so pleasantly surprised by them with Belle's treatment and they are cheap for the cover!

Out of interest, Belle didn't get neck pain until her 3rd relapse. For her it was spinal pain at first, near her back end where she tucks up - pain in the spinal column as Jan states. However, the neck pain did come and that was what made the vet refer her to a specialist.

Interestingly the specialist does beleive it is hereditory, with a trigger, such as vaccinations. I think in the US they are testing DNA of dogs affected with immune meidated diseases, of which meningitis is one, as the thinking is that there is a genetic link.

Lenk good luck with your puppy.
 
Neither of mine happened near to when vaccinated and both went on to never have a relapse and thankfully no fits. The first one was about 18 months old the second was only about 5/6 months old. Different mothers and fathers.

Over to you Lenk to post photos of new puppy
 
Meningitis while not "hereditary" in the sense that the disease itself can be passed from parent to offspring, the likelihood to develop this and other immune-mediated conditions IS thought to be hereditary.

This has been shown to be the case in Beagles, Vizlas Beardies etc although the mode of inheritance and genes involved is not yet known

it does however need some kind of "Trigger" before the disease will manifest itself

There is much research being done into likely trigger factors and causes

It can be infection , vaccination, stress, seasons, in fact just about anything that triggers an immune response, the immune system responds in- appropriately and isnt "switched off", it then attacks parts of the body it shouldnt, in the case of meningitis the lining of the spinal chord

Chemo drugs and steroids are used in the same way as in transplant patients to completely suppress this response

Experts in this field would recommend not breeding from affected individuasl or to repeat a mating when affected dogs have been produced and to use caution in breeding with siblings and parents, ie not to line breed these dogs

Most would also be very cautious in deciding whether to give these dogs Booster vaccinations as a relapse can occur at any time, the trigger factor does not have to be the same as the first instance of illness

I do have many research papers and info from Vet research that may help with treatment or general information ( from looking into the problem in whippets) so if I can help then email me

Jan
 
Jay P i'd be very intersted in any reaseach you have....just for my own info. what you've written is exactly what my specialist told me.

But Lenk, I'd like to see new puppy photos too!
 
zez said:
Jay P i'd be very intersted in any reaseach you have....just for my own info. what you've written is exactly what my specialist told me.
But Lenk, I'd like to see new puppy photos too!
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If you Pm me your email address will send you some info, its easier to attach to emails

jan
 
Meningitis while not "hereditary" in the sense that the disease itself can be passed from parent to offspring, the likelihood to develop this and other immune-mediated conditions IS thought to be hereditary.

 

This has been shown to be the case in Beagles, Vizlas Beardies etc although the mode of inheritance and genes involved is not yet known

 

Italian Greyhounds have been incredibly closely breed over the years so it wouldnt surprise if there was a hereditory link, very dog goes back to every dog one way or another although my line was outcrossed to the American lines a few years back.
 
i know nobody has posted in here for a while but I had been looking and wanting an Italian greyhound for a year and ive finally got her yesterday her name is silver and she is beautiful and healthy.

I just want to add that i got a contact off here for help putting me in touch with a reputable breeder who may have puppies and i rang her a few days later and she was sooo unbelievably rude, i told her I had found one breeder already but im trying to be sensible and find more to look into, to which i got a reply of WHATS THERE NAME? WHERE DO THEY LIVE? I told her the first name but couldn't remember the sir name, I told her where they lived to which I got the response WELL THERE A PUPPY FARMER AREN'T THEY! I responded to say that id spoken to the breeder checked them out and the mum dad where available to see, along with where they lived and the conditions they sleep in ,they where vet checked come with papers and 5 generation pedigree and that I could visit any time I wanted and I was pretty sure they where not a puppy farmer.

She responded to say WELL IF YOU KNOW ALL THAT AND THEY COME WITH PAPERS AND YOU DONT THINK SHES A PUPPY FARMER YOUR SORTED I DONT SEE HOW I CAN BE OF ANY HELP TO YOU and the phone was slammed down!

I luckily made my own decision on this person and went with my own mind, is went to see the puppy twice before I got her each time the breeder was happy to let me see everything answered all my questions showed me the mum dad cousin and there house.

She said i could call any time and that she could hold onto her for longer if I needed more time and was brilliant.

So this lady who i was told was a puppy farmer had done nothing wrong and is breeding wonderful healthy puppy's with no bad bloodlines, proof of the bloodlines and health checks and no history of broken legs.

So thankfully I have a wonderful healthy touch wood puppy and the person who gave me the contact for the horrible woman I spoke with on the had found a puppy through this horrible woman who told me I was getting a puppy farm dog, and had ended up with a pup with a broken leg! people are so stupid.

I am grateful to the lady who tried to help by giving me the awful lady's contact info as she was trying to help, and I am so sorry your pup ended up with a broken leg.

But people are so rude at times and baffle me completely.

I just had to say that because I was upset after I spoke with her she made me feel an idiot and she is in fact the idiot.

I love my puppy she is beautiful full of life and I am so grateful to the breeder I got her from.
 
I get numerous phone calls ands emails from people asking where to buy Ig puppies from. I get asked would I recommend this and that person. I used to spend a lot of time talking through the pitfalls etc, what to look out for but quite honestly these days had you phoned me I would have probably also told you to make your own mind up and do your own research. I always advise people not to buy off the internet and I have spent hours and hours supporting people when they have done and it has gone horribly wrong. However looking at it from a buyers point of view if they cant buy from a reputable breeder and they dont want to wait or get on a list what option do they have?

If it is the person I think it is you were talking to then she is inundated with calls every day. This person has taken in so many sick iggies, iggies with broken legs, iggies abandoned and has travelled many many miles to specialist vets, kept special dogs who she cant let go and where were the breeders, no where to be seen. Heaven forbid anything went wrong she would be there for you tomorrow regrdless of your converstaion with her recently.

On the flip side many people have bought off the internet and are very happy with their iggies. My real objection with the internet is that people portray themselves to be something they are not. If you are breeding and selling purely for the money then be honest about it so people can make an informed decision. I think that you should be made to declare how many litters you have advertised in the past 12 months on your adverts.

There have been many horror stories. I know of one bitch who has broke her front leg three times and the vet has said it is only a matter of time before the other one breaks. Two iggies have been put down this year due to not just breaking a leg but literally smashing the leg. Someone who tried to return a puppy after a few days as they just couldnt cope with the manic way the puppy was behaving. Yes the breeder would take it back but would not refund the money. I went and picked the puppy up and I have never in my live feared for the safety of a puppy so much before but this was wild. It took 48 hrs of proper feeding to bring it done to earth. The recommended feeding from the breeder was adult food.

If you are happy with your puppy, if you are happy with the person your bought it from then enjoy your puppy and I hope all goes well.

Dont forget to post pictures
 
I am happy with my puppy, you talk about puppys with broken legs because they have ignored advice and it has gone wrong which is fair enough but if we are in fact talking about the same person then she actually found a puppy for a person on these forums which broke its leg at 5 months old so she clearly is not finding the oh so responsible breeders she says she is.

Its completely unfair to be looked down upon because you dont go through some secret club of breeders to get a puppy, these people are total Hippocrits saying you must never go near a breeder who is advertising puppies you will end up sorry there all puppy farmers.

And it is equally as unfair to brand every single breeder who is not known to the little snooty breeders club a puppy farmer! they have no right to look down there noses at people.

I am not saying there are not bad breeders out there of course there are and people do get silly when they want a pup but most of us are intelligent enough to know when the best interest of the puppy's are at heart and when someone is just interested in your money.

and I can honestly say my puppy is so healthy and beautiful touch wood no dog goes through its whole entire life with no problems at all and if they do its unusual.

But I was told no they where puppy farmers which is ridiculous when you consider the same woman who helps people find so called reputable breeders found a girl a puppy that ended up with the broken leg we are supposed to fear from the puppy farmers!

I have tried to put a picture up here but it keeps saying file too big even though its a phone pic?
 
Nope the person I am talking about does not even come on this forum and certainly would not have recommended any breeders from this forum.

I must be a total Hippocrite then because I do advocate not buying from adverts and had never made any secret about that but that is my opinion and people can take it or leave it. If you read my other post I have also said that given that very few puppies are available buyers dont have many options open to them, but buyer beware.

I am also a member and committee member of the secret little snotty breeders club you refer to. You accuse us of looking down on people who are not members of the club but you have done the same thing in reverse without actually meeting or knowing me or other club members based on one experience.

You are right it is obvious when people are breeding for money. In the breed record supplement in the past 5 quarters there are bitches that have had 6 litters and the same bitches bred from on consecutive seasons, that is just so wrong. I am happy to send you or anyone esle who is interested copies, these are the people we are concerned about.

Legs have been broken not because people didnt look after their dogs and that is a very sweeping statement to make, it would have happened anyway due to poor bone density, there is a big difference.

Not quite sure who apart from one person you think is looking down on you. You wanted an IG. You have got an IG. YOU are happy with who you got the puppy from so what else matters?
 
Minitobe- If you are so convinced that your dogs breeder is such an absolutely top quality person, why are you being so aggressively defensive? Do you have a few doubts perhaps?
 
maybiline not at all that is very bitchy yourself.

I dont really post very often because these are very bitchy forums and i have been warned by many people to say away from them.

I just didn't like how I was treated by a lady who was supposed to me helping me to be responsible which I wanted to do and find a good breeder.

Im not making a sweeping statement about them all simply from the one experience, there are loads of people like me who have been given the same treatment when they have tried to do the right thing which pushes people to go and buy from the people who they are actually trying to stay away from in first place.

I was angry because i was told the breeder I got my italian from was a puppy farmer and that is the opposite of the truth and I would be so upset to be named a puppy farmer when in fact I was breeding responsibly and trying to do things right because we all know how grim and devastating puppy farming is and I actively try to put a stop to puppy farming.

I understand most of the people in the breed clubs are tying to do the right thing and stop bad breeding but despite how hard it is to hear they are often very obnoxious I have been told this by more people who have had the same experience as me and are too quick to brand everyone who is not in there club a puppy farmer.

The reason my post may seem aggressive to some, which if you met me I am the least aggressive person you could meet, is because I was offended that the woman who was so rude to me who was in the proper breed club found somebody a puppy and it broke its leg at 5 months and it was because there was a history in the lines of broken legs, not just an accident.

I would be devastated if I had gone down the proper route of a breed club waiting possibly 2 years and got a puppy that had a problem at 5 months old.

I love dogs and work with dogs they are my life and I take it very personally when people suggest I am going to encourage puppy farming.
 
Jan Doherty said:
Nope the person I am talking about does not even come on this forum and certainly would not have recommended any breeders from this forum.
I must be a total Hippocrite then because I do advocate not buying from adverts and had never made any secret about that but that is my opinion and people can take it or leave it. If you read my other post I have also said that given that very few puppies are available buyers dont have many options open to them, but buyer beware.

I am also a member and committee member of the secret little snotty breeders club you refer to. You accuse us of looking down on people who are not members of the club but you have done the same thing in reverse without actually meeting or knowing me or other club members based on one experience.

You are right it is obvious when people are breeding for money. In the breed record supplement in the past 5 quarters there are bitches that have had 6 litters and the same bitches bred from on consecutive seasons, that is just so wrong. I am happy to send you or anyone esle who is interested copies, these are the people we are concerned about.

Legs have been broken not because people didnt look after their dogs and that is a very sweeping statement to make, it would have happened anyway due to poor bone density, there is a big difference.

Not quite sure who apart from one person you think is looking down on you. You wanted an IG. You have got an IG. YOU are happy with who you got the puppy from so what else matters?
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I cannot see any possible justification for breeding from a bitch on consecutive seasons, or for a bitch to have 6 litters- THAT is puppy farming in my book :eek:

And what happens to the poor bitch when she is too old to be bred from? Passed on like an unwanted piece of furniture, advertised on one of the many online sites or worse:(

You don't have to keep loads of dogs outside in filthy kennels or sell puppies in pet shops to be a puppy farmer- there are many people doing it in nice suburban houses in nice areas- in ALL breeds.

Liz and the Monellis
 
What an excellent post, Liz. You have beaten me to it as I was about to post something similar.

Puppy farmers are not all multi breed establishments but can best be described as back yard breeders. These people may have a small number of bitches of only one or two breeds but breed them into the ground. These despicable people sugarcoat themselves to customers by saying how much they love their dogs, and that their dogs are their lives! What they really mean is 'MY DOGS ARE MY LIVING!' The people who buy from them propagate this cruelty by subscribing to the I WANT IT NOW culture, not giving a thought to the poor bitches. Of course the puppies will look healthy, they take all they need from the bitch. Can any caring person honestly say that 6 litters from one bitch is an acceptable practice?

The amount of litters bred is not hearsay,it is published in the KC Breed Record Supplement, which can either be bought from the KC or the information is freely available from the breed club.

Mintobe, if you are such an expert on broken legs and IG breeders, I am curious as to why you asked for advise in the first place.
 
I really dont care for your continuous snippy bitchy comments mabiline, notice how above before you joined there was an ADULT debate there was no personal bitchiness going on.

Im not rising to it, I know the lady I bought my pup off does not over breed her bitches and is a lovely person and I love my Italian greyhound and at her recent vet check and jab,s the vet said she is absolutely perfect and healthy and I hope she lives a long and happy life with me and I couldn't care less about any body else's personal opinion on the matter.
 
mintobe said:
I really dont care for your continuous snippy bitchy comments mabiline, notice how above before you joined there was an ADULT debate there was no personal bitchiness going on.Im not rising to it, I know the lady I bought my pup off does not over breed her bitches and is a lovely person and I love my Italian greyhound and at her recent vet check and jab,s the vet said she is absolutely perfect and healthy and I hope she lives a long and happy life with me and I couldn't care less about any body else's personal opinion on the matter.
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Can I just ask how you know the person you got your iggie from does does not 'over breed'? I think you have brought the criticism on yourself here by being so defensive.

Personally I would only buy an iggie on a recommend from a bona fide iggie show person or breeder. they are not your general run of the mill little dog. But you'll find that out!
 
bertha said:
mintobe said:
I really dont care for your continuous snippy bitchy comments mabiline, notice how above before you joined there was an ADULT debate there was no personal bitchiness going on.Im not rising to it, I know the lady I bought my pup off does not over breed her bitches and is a lovely person and I love my Italian greyhound and at her recent vet check and jab,s the vet said she is absolutely perfect and healthy and I hope she lives a long and happy life with me and I couldn't care less about any body else's personal opinion on the matter.
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Can I just ask how you know the person you got your iggie from does does not 'over breed'? I think you have brought the criticism on yourself here by being so defensive.

Personally I would only buy an iggie on a recommend from a bona fide iggie show person or breeder. they are not your general run of the mill little dog. But you'll find that out!
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my italian greyhound is a kc registered puppy with champions in her bloodlines and proof of this and proof of the health checks and proof of how many times her bitches are bred, not that its any of your business, and I think you will find most people who post on these forums are defensive and some very bitchy biut you dont need me to tell you that do you

and dont worry I wont be bringing any more upon myself because im not continuing to post on a forum where people are more interested in getting one up on each other, than they are about there actual love of dogs which is actually why I joined this forum in the first place.
 
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