Maiden Groups

[Carol Brown]

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Can anybody please explain what a Maiden dog is?

There has been dogs winning multipals in this event this year, suely if they have won a Maiden class, they are no longer a Maiden , and should not be entered in this class and should run in the MAIN

Surely the program can be changed on the day, by the Racing Manager

Ray Pond EAWRC Race Manager

 

[June Jonigk]

I think the rule is that once a dog has won a maiden group or a main final, they are then unable to enter another maiden class - but if they have already entered, and the closing date has gone, they are able to take part.

 

[Mark Roberts]

Junes spot on whith her answer.

once a dog has won a maiden Main final it is no longer allowed to run in anymore maiden groups unless the closing date has already passed for another open but if the closing dates not passed its the owners responsibilty to notify the club concerned and change the dog into the main group.

 

[jade]

maybe this should be change and once won a maiden be able to move in to the main, as there are not many maidens a year so everyone gets a chance i remember deadly solution being move when he won at andover and the next week was in a maiden and already entered and closing date passed i had no problem with this and the somerset draw was done at the end of cotwold open i think ?so dogs that had won there should have been move i maybe wrong, but surely it wont be to hard to move them anyway even if it on the day this way its fair too all i think the rules need to be looked at ? dont all shoot me at once

 

[peppermint lady]

:thumbsup: i agree with you ray...it wouldnt take 2 minutes for each person to alter their own program at the time the weights are given out :thumbsup:

its like lots of people said i should of put peppermint perfection on the maiden at somerset :wacko: :wacko: as the sporting champs is not under wcra rules :unsure:

but how selfish would i have looked winning at the sporting and then running a maiden :- " with only about 5 maidens running each year i also think this needs looking at....maybe a topic for the wcra talk in?? :thumbsup:

 

[Mark Roberts]

maybe this should be change and once won a maiden be able to move in to the main, as there are not many maidens a year so everyone gets a chance  i remember deadly solution being move when he won at andover and the next week was in a maiden and already entered and closing date passed i had no problem with this  and the somerset draw was done at the end of cotwold open  i think ?so dogs that had won there should have been move  i maybe wrong,  but surely it wont be to hard to move them anyway even if it on the day this way its fair too all  i think the rules need to be looked at ?   dont all  shoot me at once

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the problem with that would be that if a clubs done a draw and it has just the right numbers for heat, semi's finals then an extra dog would throw the whole programme out?.

I think what causes the problem is a lot of clubs do their draw on the Sunday before meaning the draw has been done before the previous weeks racing has finished a way round it would be for clubs to hold over the draw till the monday and hopfully owners would ring up and change maiden winners to the main group?.

 

[peppermint lady]

maybe this should be change and once won a maiden be able to move in to the main, as there are not many maidens a year so everyone gets a chance  i remember deadly solution being move when he won at andover and the next week was in a maiden and already entered and closing date passed i had no problem with this  and the somerset draw was done at the end of cotwold open  i think ?so dogs that had won there should have been move  i maybe wrong,  but surely it wont be to hard to move them anyway even if it on the day this way its fair too all  i think the rules need to be looked at ?   dont all  shoot me at once

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the problem with that would be that if a clubs done a draw and it has just the right numbers for heat, semi's finals then an extra dog would throw the whole programme out?.

I think what causes the problem is a lot of clubs do their draw on the Sunday before meaning the draw has been done before the previous weeks racing has finished a way round it would be for clubs to hold over the draw till the monday and hopfully owners would ring up and change maiden winners to the main group?.

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yes thats a good idea mark :thumbsup: do the draw on a monday, so dogs can be moved....

but why when deadly solution won a maiden, and was booked in for the following week to run another, he WAS moved to the main....closing date had passed :wacko:

my sister would have rather seen him in the main...to give others a shot at the maiden :thumbsup:

 

[Judy]

Changing the programme is not always possible. If there is a 3 dog race for the dog to go in then its usually OK but if not it could mean you have to have a whole extra round for that dog. I think the closing date rule is a sensible one but would like to think that if the draw hasn't been done yet and the owner notifies the club then it would be changed. Doing the draw on a Monday would be fine but from personal experience its not always possible to wait - eg. having other arrangements might mean you can't meet up with whoever you're doing the draw with and still leaving enough time to type up and print the programmes.

 

[BeeJay]

:thumbsup: i agree with you ray...it wouldnt take 2 minutes for each person to alter their own program at the time the weights are given out :thumbsup:
its like lots of people said i should of put peppermint perfection on the maiden at somerset :wacko:   :wacko:   as the sporting champs is not under wcra rules :unsure:

but how selfish would i have looked winning at the sporting and then running a maiden :- " with only about 5 maidens running each year i also think this needs looking at....maybe a topic for the wcra talk in?? :thumbsup:

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I think that you would have found that there would have been objections to this Julie. When Alchemist won at Oxford some people said to me that he could still run in Maidens at affliated opens. Whilst I never had any intention of running Alchemist in any Maidens I did mention this to a few friends and they all told me that there would have been objections if I had entered him in a maiden after he had won at Oxford.

NOT that I would have been objecting to Maddie being in the Maiden at West Somerset. :- "

 

[peppermint lady]

:thumbsup: i agree with you ray...it wouldnt take 2 minutes for each person to alter their own program at the time the weights are given out :thumbsup:
its like lots of people said i should of put peppermint perfection on the maiden at somerset :wacko:   :wacko:   as the sporting champs is not under wcra rules :unsure:

but how selfish would i have looked winning at the sporting and then running a maiden :- " with only about 5 maidens running each year i also think this needs looking at....maybe a topic for the wcra talk in?? :thumbsup:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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I think that you would have found that there would have been objections to this Julie. When Alchemist won at Oxford some people said to me that he could still run in Maidens at affliated opens. Whilst I never had any intention of running Alchemist in any Maidens I did mention this to a few friends and they all told me that there would have been objections if I had entered him in a maiden after he had won at Oxford.

NOT that I would have been objecting to Maddie being in the Maiden at West Somerset. :- "

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:lol: :lol: i was the same as you barbara, i wouldnt of put maddie in the maiden AFTER winning at the sporting champs...however had she not won i would have put her in a maiden untill she did win :thumbsup:

 

[lynxexpress]

Junes spot on whith her answer.
once a dog has won a maiden Main final it is no longer allowed to run in anymore maiden groups unless the closing date has already passed for another open but if the closing dates not passed its the owners responsibilty to notify the club concerned and change the dog into the main group.

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There is a dog that was brought to my attention on Sunday that had run and won the last THREE MAIDEN OPENS so how does that work.

 

[Judy]

I'm not sure that the idea of what a Maiden is, is necessarily exclusively a WCRA thing anyway is it? Non affiliated clubs can still run a maiden if they want to so personally I don't think that the matter of whether the Maiden was at a WCRA event should come into it anyway.

Fortunately I can never remember it being a problem as everyone has always done the decent thing like you two have, Barbara & Julie :thumbsup: except of course if the closing date has gone by and there was nothing they could do about it. Most people do try to change if they can.

 

[BeeJay]

I think that this has occured because we had 3 opens held on consecutive weeks that had Maiden groups. The dogs that won 'out of' Maiden at the 1st of these were unable to change into the Elite groups at the other 2 opens because the draws for both of them had already taken place.

 

[Judy]

Junes spot on whith her answer.
once a dog has won a maiden Main final it is no longer allowed to run in anymore maiden groups unless the closing date has already passed for another open but if the closing dates not passed its the owners responsibilty to notify the club concerned and change the dog into the main group.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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There is a dog that was brought to my attention on Sunday that had run and won the last THREE MAIDEN OPENS so how does that work.

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I think the dog you are talking about first won at the Cotswolds. By then not only had the closing date gone for Gloucester but we had also done the draw. The closing date for West Somerset was the day before the Cotswolds. I have a feeling they did the draw that day so would probably not have known that the dog had just won a maiden. I don't think anything underhand was done here. It was unfortunate that three maidens came in a row, one week after the other, so it was always a possibilty that this could happen but maybe it just shows that we need, or at least want, more Maidens opens.

Our Time After Time won two Maidens. One at Andover and one the following week at the Cotswolds. We did try to get it changed but it was too late.

 

[Judy]

Sorry Barbara I've just seen you had already answered that one.

 

[jade]

im luckly enough to have won maidens or opens with all my dogs but some people are not that lucky and fine it hard racing against the elite so yes judy more maidens :thumbsup: k9 is for any comment good or bad just trying to air our views all for the love of racing

 

[peppermint lady]

the draw for somerset was done on the day of s.cot...so racing had finished

 

[BeeJay]

the draw for somerset was done on the day of s.cot...so racing had finished

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Nope the draw was done on the Sunday morning prior to the South Cotswold Open starting to race. So the draw was done before the dogs actually won out of Maiden.

 

[peppermint lady]

the draw for somerset was done on the day of s.cot...so racing had finished

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Nope the draw was done on the Sunday morning prior to the South Cotswold Open starting to race. So the draw was done before the dogs actually won out of Maiden.

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my mistake then :thumbsup:

i thought sheila said to me the draw was later that day

 

[Joanna]

Our dog was one of the ones who won out of maidens at S.Cots, but the draw had already taken place for the Glos the following week and had we entered W.Somerset, that draw would have been completed too. As it happened, our fellow bombed at Glos (God love him he tried but hey, never mind we had a great day any-way), and was knocked out.

Come on folks, if a draw has taken place it could end up a logistical nightmare to change the plan on the day. It took us three years to win a maiden, there are always good dogs that are a tough to beat and I do believe the location of an open makes a difference. We had a limited South Eastern and Northern entry when our little fellow pulled it out of the bag, I won't denigrate his effort, but to be fair it could have been a very different outcome if the entry had been larger and from further afield.

Please remember that maidens don't count for points in the big picture and no-one has broken a rule. Don't take the glory and joy away from a good dog, if it was yours, you might feel upset by accusatory comments.