Pedigree Dogs Exposed

[midlanderkeith]

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I race and show my dog, he is competing and winning at club level, and getting placed at Ch shows!His sire is a well known champion and his dam is an unknown bitch with what today could be called old fashioned lines well known lines. He is nothing really like his sire, he and the rest of the litter have taken after their dam.

It is very interesting that the racing friends I have think he is a good racing dog. In the right hands he could have been a good working dog.

So, it all seems to depend on what is behind them that makes them dual purpose!

I to have raced 'slow' show dogs, with this one I hope he goes on winning in both fields.

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Thats it Bertha, in the right hands, say no more

 

[Joanna]

I race and show my dog, he is competing and winning at club level, and getting placed at Ch shows!His sire is a well known champion and his dam is an unknown bitch with what today could be called old fashioned lines well known lines. He is nothing really like his sire, he and the rest of the litter have taken after their dam.

It is very interesting that the racing friends I have think he is a good racing dog. In the right hands he could have been a good working dog.

So, it all seems to depend on what is behind them that makes them dual purpose!

I to have raced 'slow' show dogs, with this one I hope he goes on winning in both fields.

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Thats it Bertha, in the right hands, say no more

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Are you implying that I am not the "right hands" to race a show-bred dog. I would say I champion my show-bred whippet beyond ANY in the racing world. He even gets entered in the Champs. I waste £9 entering him, but HE LOVES IT. Don't believe that you can begin to tell me that I am incapable. He trains EVERY week in winter on the track and has been schooled for 5 years. He will never be a fast dog, but he is great at supporting puppies and enjoys what he does !. I take huge exception to your post. then again, it isn't actually more than I would expect. I hear you've dabbled on the track. Good for you, I've never seen you racing your bitch at opens or the champs, despite what you may feel about her ability, I expect she would be about as good as my show-bred in that environment :- "

 

[SilverScreen]

A DIFFERENT VIEW. A man-written breed standard is NONSENSE - only God can determin what a creature, including us, should look like.  The silly and frivolous persuit of perfection in dogs and dog showing is, in my opinion, as outdated as the Miss World contest and should be banned - Not least for the resons outlined in last nights tv programme, Pedigree Dogs Exposed.
Whippets have NOT escaped man's interference either!  Show Whippets are MUCH bigger than any of their ancesters and could not, for example, hold their own against a coursing or race Whippet. And as we all know, the Kennel Club had to recently change the Whippet Breed Standard again to accomodate for this human intervention in the breed.

When will we learn to leave well alone.

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An alternative different view - every dog in this country has had human intervention, even coursing and racing whippets, so where does the 'leaving well alone' start?

Every single dog in this country is an artifically created animal

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Of course you are correct but it has to STOP somewhere. Otherwise we end up with the situations outlined in the programme last night.

 

[rls22]

It comes down to responsible carefully considered breeding in the future - simple.

I know we are putting very careful thought into any future breeding. We want to have healthy, happy hounds - that can run, catch bunnies and also do us proud in the show ring but above all are fantastic pets that we can let go to their new homes in the knowledge that they will not be riddled with some awful disease.

Being a successful show dog does not have to mean some mutated freak as some seem to think. I am not saying my dogs could win any races, they couldn't. They are however, more than capable of doing what they were bred to do.

 

[SilverScreen]

It comes down to responsible carefully considered breeding in the future - simple.  I know we are putting very careful thought into any future breeding.  We want to have healthy, happy hounds - that can run, catch bunnies and also do us proud in the show ring but above all are fantastic pets that we can let go to their new homes in the knowledge that they will not be riddled with some awful disease. 

Being a successful show dog does not have to mean some mutated freak as some seem to think.  I am not saying my dogs could win any races, they couldn't.  They are however, more than capable of doing what they were bred to do.

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The programme last night rightly showed that dog showing is a multimillion pound industry and that will corrupt!! I've 'showed' dogs myself and I know how bent it is - we all kow how bent it is - too much has been ignored. I really don't believe that show dogs, in general, have good lives and I know that many are pushed from piller to post, from one country to another, from one person to another!

 

[rls22]

Well I know my 'show dogs' have a wonderful life. As I type all 3 of them are snuggled up with their 'Dad' on the sofa after 2 lovely walks and 2 tasty meals today.

They suffer the terrible occasional hardship :- " of going for a day out at a show a couple of times a month, which incidently they love.

They are all here for life, those that show and those that don't. We also spent a lot of time vetting homes to make sure all our precious pups went to loving permanent homes.

Don't be so quick to tar everyone with the same brush.

Nearly everyone who I have met since showing whippets treats their dogs as we do ours; as a much loved family member.

Let's please not go down this route yet again, it has been done to death on dozens of other threads.

 

[joe90]

After watching this programme I am disgusted to see what is happening to people's pets and I hope the BBC and the Goverment take radical action. I hope the people that buys these dogs sue the breeders!!!
I HOPE THAT THIS IS THE END TO CRUFTS!!!

I feel so sorry for these helpless animals they look deformed, dogs are supposed to look like wolves not aliens!

:rant:   :rant:   :rant:   :rant:   :rant:   :rant:

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IMO its the owners faults for buying the dogs in the first place, they go for pups whose parents arent health tested cus they are cheap and then blame the breeder when things go wrong. and as for the ones who didnt know their pet could get those inherited diseases ??? research the breed you want b4 u buy!!

 

[foxway]

After watching this programme I am disgusted to see what is happening to people's pets and I hope the BBC and the Goverment take radical action. I hope the people that buys these dogs sue the breeders!!!
I HOPE THAT THIS IS THE END TO CRUFTS!!!

I feel so sorry for these helpless animals they look deformed, dogs are supposed to look like wolves not aliens!

:rant:   :rant:   :rant:   :rant:   :rant:   :rant:

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IMO its the owners faults for buying the dogs in the first place, they go for pups whose parents arent health tested cus they are cheap and then blame the breeder when things go wrong. and as for the ones who didnt know their pet could get those inherited diseases ??? research the breed you want b4 u buy!!

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Ive just rememberd whyi stayed away from this site for a good year, Ban crufts? ive never heard such a load of pap in all my life! Not all ''show people'' as u call us breed bad dogs, i for one do not! we breed smooth fox terriers, which are now a listed vunerabale breed once the most popular in the 1940's last year there were only 36 litters registered! if we didnt keep up with this, the wonderful dog the smooth would be non existent and in my eyes what a sad place it would be without my beloved smooths, our smooths are pets first and foremost and litters are only available every 2 years, we dont ever have more than one litter in 18months, we also show our smooths and take a very long time deciding on which sire to use, for not only to breed typical breed standard but firstly a sound temperment, if i am lucky enough to get a good one in the litter why shouldnt i show my dog of to all his glory? and be proud of my breed line, If you look at the history of the smooth u will see not much has changed except a smoother coat has been achived my terriers are as true to type in personality they play, are a full handfull, lots of fun and keen to learn new tricks and can chase and catch a rat, also are friendly with children, in which the breed are known to be the baby sitter of the canine world, now im not saying that my smooths are the best breed around we have some faults as all dogs do, is there such a thing as a perfect dog? as people who do show know its usually the person on the end of the lead who gets the ticket! but i do know that my smooths are happy, healthy and more, they sleep under the duvet with me(2 of them but 2 live in kennels which they prefer they dont settle indoors) are fed the best food and exercised reguarly, do u lot really think breeders and exhibitors would spend in my tally a whooping £4000 a year exhibiting dogs and paying for the best of everything, if not more depending on how many times you will travel miles to and from dog shows if all that comes of it is a badly breed exhibit and not only that a unhealthy pup, bad temperment or to ill treat our prized pooch! I have two wonderful children but before i started breeding and exhibiting dogs weekends were mundane stuck in all week with two screaming kids, showing is a great passion of mine and the dogs go crazy when they see the show leads, mostly i travel miles for a 3rd prize card but that doesnt matter to me or my pooches we went we exhibited what we were made of and i get to take the champions of my heart home with me. After 6 years of breeding i gained a 1st at crufts this year now i dont know if thats because ive breed a good one or if its beacuse my face is starting to fit?I know people in my breed with champions and breed on a more regular basis than me, but there dogs sleep in the bed too and are throughly spolit! please try not to tarnish all people with the same brush it really is very upsetting to read such horrible comments, Yes some dogs are shown and kept in kennels but im sure the conditions are suitable, for heavens sake a dog is of course a wild animal that we have tamed and eventually started to treat like a baby over the years they are more than capable to be outside as long as the are fed have water and shelter and are hppy with the surroundings, what is the harm in keeping them like this? sorry to blab on but it really gets my goose when the good breeders and dog owners are slanderd for a passion of showing. People are always trying to find things to ban and are mostly the things they know litte about, i expect this programme was a distastefull insight to the pedigree world and didnt even mention all the good hard work that respectable breeders have been achiving for 100's of years.

b

 

[Louise_Simon]

I race and show my dog, he is competing and winning at club level, and getting placed at Ch shows!His sire is a well known champion and his dam is an unknown bitch with what today could be called old fashioned lines well known lines. He is nothing really like his sire, he and the rest of the litter have taken after their dam.

It is very interesting that the racing friends I have think he is a good racing dog. In the right hands he could have been a good working dog.

So, it all seems to depend on what is behind them that makes them dual purpose!

I to have raced 'slow' show dogs, with this one I hope he goes on winning in both fields.

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Thats it Bertha, in the right hands, say no more

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Are you implying that I am not the "right hands" to race a show-bred dog. I would say I champion my show-bred whippet beyond ANY in the racing world. He even gets entered in the Champs. I waste £9 entering him, but HE LOVES IT. Don't believe that you can begin to tell me that I am incapable. He trains EVERY week in winter on the track and has been schooled for 5 years. He will never be a fast dog, but he is great at supporting puppies and enjoys what he does !. I take huge exception to your post. then again, it isn't actually more than I would expect. I hear you've dabbled on the track. Good for you, I've never seen you racing your bitch at opens or the champs, despite what you may feel about her ability, I expect she would be about as good as my show-bred in that environment :- "

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Most whippets will chase i think, but doing well at club level and doing well at opens or the champs is a different story. My little show bred bitch managed to get 'bitch of the year' last year at our club, not through speed but by persistance.

Like Jo, I have one of each, both love racing but I have no expectations of my show bred bitch doing well at an open. but she also is good for schooling pups. (I dont waste £9 on entering her in the champs )

 

[SilverScreen]

Well I know my 'show dogs' have a wonderful life.  As I type all 3 of them are snuggled up with their 'Dad' on the sofa after 2 lovely walks and 2 tasty meals today.  They suffer the terrible occasional hardship :- "  of going for a day out at a show a couple of times a month, which incidently they love.

They are all here for life, those that show and those that don't.  We also spent a lot of time vetting homes to make sure all our precious pups went to loving permanent homes.

Don't be so quick to tar everyone with the same brush. 

Nearly everyone who I have met since showing whippets treats their dogs as we do ours; as a much loved family member.

Let's please not go down this route yet again, it has been done to death on dozens of other threads.

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Sorry if my comments offended you. I'm not tarring all with the same brush as you suggest - I simply expressed MY view based on MY experience and said "in general" with regard my thoughts on how show dogs are often kept and owned! Of course I know that some show dogs are kept well and loved deeply.

I still think the programme Pedigree Dogs Exposed was a brilliant because the Kennel Club has needed to be challenged for many years. I cannot see how anyone who saw the programme cannot have huge concerns over the points raised and doubt the future of shows like Crufts. Personally I hope the BBC pulls the plug!

PS: We must be FREE on this site tro express differing views and debate! My views are simply MY views and are not intended to offend or anger and are not directed at anyone in particular.

 

[bertha]

I race and show my dog, he is competing and winning at club level, and getting placed at Ch shows!His sire is a well known champion and his dam is an unknown bitch with what today could be called old fashioned lines well known lines. He is nothing really like his sire, he and the rest of the litter have taken after their dam.

It is very interesting that the racing friends I have think he is a good racing dog. In the right hands he could have been a good working dog.

So, it all seems to depend on what is behind them that makes them dual purpose!

I to have raced 'slow' show dogs, with this one I hope he goes on winning in both fields.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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Thats it Bertha, in the right hands, say no more

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Are you implying that I am not the "right hands" to race a show-bred dog. I would say I champion my show-bred whippet beyond ANY in the racing world. He even gets entered in the Champs. I waste £9 entering him, but HE LOVES IT. Don't believe that you can begin to tell me that I am incapable. He trains EVERY week in winter on the track and has been schooled for 5 years. He will never be a fast dog, but he is great at supporting puppies and enjoys what he does !. I take huge exception to your post. then again, it isn't actually more than I would expect. I hear you've dabbled on the track. Good for you, I've never seen you racing your bitch at opens or the champs, despite what you may feel about her ability, I expect she would be about as good as my show-bred in that environment :- "

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I have sent you a PM. You have totally misunderstood me! I run a dog, not a bitch and he too trains every week. :ermm:

 

[beaker]

this program may have been in some way useful for giving some of the short sighted breeders of suffering breeds a smart kick up the pants, to make them look without blinkers at what is happening to their breeds but unfortunately the program, which had the potential to be excellent and informative, disapointingly changed it's program agenda half way through and turned into a sensationalist Kennel Club witchhunt , less focus was put on responsible breeding ethics and not once did it offer any kind of advice or scientific solution to the loss of genetic diversity, nope, it just kept on drilling into the viewers that the Kennel club is bad, the breeders and showers are bad and pedigree dogs are all damned and should be PTS...

not IMO a healthy way of promoting dogs in an ever increasing anti-dog society :angry:

The KC is by no means blameless and they could certainly do one hell of a lot more with the ever increasing fee's they demand but the blame cannot be laid soley at the kennel clubs door for the state of some breeds now, breed standards, though kept in paper by the kennel club, were originally written out by breeders, they are followed by breeders and dogs judged against it BY THE BREEDERS.

when i say it's the "breeders" that are ultimately responsible, DO NOT read "showies", it is everyone's responsibility, be it pet, race, work or show... if you are only willing to travel to local dogs, only breed for certain traits like colour, only use show dogs from 'certain lines', only use race dogs from 'certain lines' or insist that only pups strongly bred out of one kennel will be fit for purpose, then it is YOU!!! that is reducing the genetic diversity.

like it or not the blame is on everyone and until someone sets up and open and honest pedigree site, with coefficient data available to all, until genetic testing is done on every single registered dog and until the Kennel club "grow a pair" and start standing up for some good breeding principles, then absolutely nothing is going to change for the better

 

[Joanna]

I race and show my dog, he is competing and winning at club level, and getting placed at Ch shows!His sire is a well known champion and his dam is an unknown bitch with what today could be called old fashioned lines well known lines. He is nothing really like his sire, he and the rest of the litter have taken after their dam.

It is very interesting that the racing friends I have think he is a good racing dog. In the right hands he could have been a good working dog.

So, it all seems to depend on what is behind them that makes them dual purpose!

I to have raced 'slow' show dogs, with this one I hope he goes on winning in both fields.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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Thats it Bertha, in the right hands, say no more

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Are you implying that I am not the "right hands" to race a show-bred dog. I would say I champion my show-bred whippet beyond ANY in the racing world. He even gets entered in the Champs. I waste £9 entering him, but HE LOVES IT. Don't believe that you can begin to tell me that I am incapable. He trains EVERY week in winter on the track and has been schooled for 5 years. He will never be a fast dog, but he is great at supporting puppies and enjoys what he does !. I take huge exception to your post. then again, it isn't actually more than I would expect. I hear you've dabbled on the track. Good for you, I've never seen you racing your bitch at opens or the champs, despite what you may feel about her ability, I expect she would be about as good as my show-bred in that environment :- "

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I have sent you a PM. You have totally misunderstood me! I run a dog, not a bitch and he too trains every week. :ermm:

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Thank-you, it was the comment below yours and the "say no more" I was responding to, this person has dabbled on the race track with his bitch. I have replied to you and explained.