Pyometra

[Sarsanet]

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Hi Everyone. As you know Lida, my Alice got a pyometre after her first season at 12 mnths & had to be spayed. Now, at 2.5 years she has problems with her sphyncter muscle & leaks urine but only at night while she's asleep. She will be on drugs for the rest of her life, drugs that in the long term will affect her bone marrow so I'm desperate to find an alternative treatment for her. So far, no luck. Vet says whatever drugs or hormone therapy I use, it has to be estrogen based. You saw her yourself last week so you know she's fit & healthy for now but I worry about her future.

We seem to be hearing about so many more cases of pyometre now than in years gone by - could it be inhereted?

What does everyone else think?

 

[bardmand]

We seem to be hearing about so many more cases of pyometre now than in years gone by - could it be inhereted?What does everyone else think?

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My first two bitches (born 1988 and 1990) both got pyo in their advanced years. My current puppy has not yet had her first season, but obviously it will be in the back of my mind if she ever is less than fit.

I guess infections cannot be inherited, but perhaps weak immune systems might. Severe in- and linebreeding will eventually weaken the immune systems of the specimens it produces.

I don't know if there have been any studies on the frequency of pyo in different breeds? That might suggest some answers?

 

[bardmand]

googling around, I found this:

http://www.vca.org.au/AboutVCA.asp?ID=84

Apparently, they are developing a vaccine against pyometra - that must mean it is not that uncommon?

 

[sandrag]

(w00t) this is really scary i joind the k9 site early this week as we are looking for a whippet or greyhound we want a female anyway since then all i have heard from people is about pya i have a female shoh tze she is not spayed I have been told by lots of greyhound rehomers that two females should not live togther if one is not spayed and one is. One even said 70%of bitches die from pya. I have not got any intensions of breeding form my shih tze but i did not realise it was so serious and that i must get her spayed or its matter of life or death

 

[kim & Tilly]

I have two whippet bitches, and will not be getting them spayed

 

Authough i will be looking out for signs each time they have a season...and i can thank K9 for keeping us informed of problems, that i knew nothing about

 

[Crystal]

Hi, quite a few years ago my GSD (she was 2) had an open pyometra, the first thing I noticed was her puffing and panting and large dobs of pus, she had had a season some 6 weeks previous, she had never had any jabs to suppress her season, after she was spayed she lived a long and happy life but after spaying she did suffer from bladder leakage, but had medication to help.

Then last year my very young Siamese Cat 11 months had a slight discharge that was first diagnosed as 'Vaginitis' and treated with antibiotics which worked for a few weeks, it is very unusual for cats to get pyometra and I was very unsure, her breeder was adamant that it wasn't(I scanned the internet, contacted a vet in Canada etc). I requested that she was scanned and the scan did not show up any swelling , the 2nd vet I saw diagnosed pyometra and wanted to spay her immediately - I asked that she was treated with antibiotics and unfortunately treated like a 2nd class citizen, I was told that they could treat her with prostaglandins(to contract the womb and get all pus out) which were not licensed in the U.K there were side affects ultimately death!!! I had to sign a disclaimer, but before they used the drugs, Imp had responded to treatment with antibiotics, and within 2 days was back to normal, one of the vets from the practice rang and said that the tests on the discharge showed an e-coli infection . The vet advised if I wanted to have a litter then it had to be as soon as possible as another season/call unmated may cause problems - she had a healthy litter 6 months later. The only reason I went down the antibiotic route is because the vet was unsure, and everything pointed to an infection but not pyometra?? One vet was adamant it was - especially after the e-coli was found but she was recovering by the time the tests came back.(sorry it's so long winded)

 

[Seraphina]

One even said 70%of bitches die from pya. I have not got any intensions of breeding form my shih tze but i did not realise it was so serious and that i must get her spayed or its matter of life or death   

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I can assure you that 70% is NOT realistic. Hundred years ago nobody spayed anything and most bitches did get through their lives without getting pyometra. I show and breed and therefore my bitches are not spayed, over the years I have owned number of bitches and I know lot of other entire female dogs. My friends have had about 20 dogs in their kennels at one time - most of them female. When something so frightening like pyometra happens, it is immediately the talk of the whole "show scene". Especially nowadays with emails news get around the world in minutes. I do realise that just because I have only ever heard of 3 cases it does not mean there have not been more, but in the same time just because somebody had such a bad luck to have it in 2 bitches it does not mean every 2 out of 3 entire bitches will get it.

I think that these grossly inflated figures are being publisezed by the people who want everything desexed.

I would like to see some real figures. Where is ILKC?

 

[~whitecross whippets~]

pyo is most common in bitches over 8yrs who have never been mated...years ago dogs were not spayed but had many litters too :thumbsup:

 

[~Helen~]

I have been told by lots of greyhound rehomers that two females should not live togther if one is not spayed and one is.

Is that right? I thought it wasn't contagious but would like to know more about this living together spayed/unspayed :unsure:

edited to say: and thinking about it, why would living with a spayed bitch increase an unspayed bitch's risk of getting pyo? Surely the spayed one isn't going to get it/have it if she doesn't have a uterus? So she can't be a risk to the entire bitch. Unless I'm missing something :b

 

[~whitecross whippets~]

she is not spayed I have been told by lots of greyhound rehomers that two females should not live togther if one is not spayed and one is.

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are you sure this comment was made in relation to pyometra...imo i would have thought it was a comment made concerning dominance issues?? :thumbsup:

 

[~whitecross whippets~]

What I do not understand; if it is a bacterial infection why doesn't it respond to antibiotics? Many years ago, my bitch developed disgusting smelly discharge after mating, she was put on massive dose of antibiotics, and i was told that even if she did conceive there is no way the pups can survive this, and she will abort them. Well, they did survive, ALL 15 of them!!! (w00t)

if the bacteria enters while the cervix is open ...it is a open pyo and can sometimes be treated with fluid therapy and antibiotics....

if however the cervix closes due to either excess thickening (caused by hormonal changes) or from their season ending then the pus builds up rapidly and the toxins enter the bloodstream and can cause death quite rapidly...in closed pyo spaying is usually the only hope of survival

 

[Seraphina]

(w00t) One even said 70%of bitches die from pya.

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Could he possibly mean that 70% WHO HAVE pyometra die? Although even that seem to me bit high, I read somewhere that death rate is about 50%, and as Whitecross said it is a mainly disease of old bitches. However the 2 girls Alice and Zara, that had it recently, were both just year old.

 

[~whitecross whippets~]

(w00t) One even said 70%of bitches die from pya.

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Could he possibly mean that 70% WHO HAVE pyometra die? Although even that seem to me bit high, I read somewhere that death rate is about 50%, and as Whitecross said it is a mainly disease of old bitches. However the 2 girls Alice and Zara, that had it recently, were both just year old.

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i agree ...imo i cant believe that 70% bitches die from pyo.... but i would think a figure of around 70% of bitches who get pyo probably do die...its very high especially in closed pyo :thumbsup:

 

[bardmand]

(w00t) One even said 70%of bitches die from pya.

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Could he possibly mean that 70% WHO HAVE pyometra die? Although even that seem to me bit high, I read somewhere that death rate is about 50%, and as Whitecross said it is a mainly disease of old bitches. However the 2 girls Alice and Zara, that had it recently, were both just year old.

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That sounds more likely, but as you say, still quite high. I think perhaps it is quite often not diagnosed as pyo (esp. closed pyo) early enough. Such a massive infection can really take a toll on the entire system of an older bitch.

My first whippet had closed pyo at age 10. It was not diagnosed as such until two days after the first time we brought her to the vet. She had none of the classic symptoms of pyo (no excessive drinking, no temperature), but was obviously not well. She was immediately spayed, recovered quite quickly, and lived a full and happy life for another three years.

Still, I do not think I am going to spay my current bitch, even if I do not plan on breeding from her. If she does get pyo, I will make sure she will get the surgery sooner rather than later. If not, I would rather not let her undergo surgery at all.

Also, if there is an inherited predisposition for pyometra - how are we to know if nearly all bitches are spayed?

 

[~whitecross whippets~]

the danger is with a closed pyo is that it can be difficult to diagnose because there are not necessarily any major outward symptoms...what is usually noticed is an increase in thirst maybe lack of energy and loss of appetite...for some days or weeks beforehand... but always following a season....these symptoms may be mild even though the bitch is on the verge of toxic shock..

many owners know their bitch is behaving slightly differently but often put it down to changes sometimes seen with having a normal season..

because of this owners do not bring their pets in until it is too late

 

[jools]

Thanks for the information Nina, Tizzy, my collie x was also given an injection to knock her season off - she was rushed in 3 weeks later and had an emergency spey through pyo. This was 5 years ago and I always wondered if the jab had in some way induced the pyo - though the vets said not!

I stopped using the vets not long after, just wasn't happy with some of their decisions on foster dogs.

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I have to say i am not a fan of anything that interferes with a bitch's natural cycle. I know its difficult & most vets will say the injection is completely harmless BUT my vet did admit that these injections can cause problems & he couldn't honestly say hand on heart that these injections definitely would not cause a pyometra.

I have never had one of these season delaying injections so cant honestly say either way BUT i do know several people who have had them & had nothing but problems afterwards including Pyometra & also not being able to get the bitch's in whelp at a later date when they have decided to mate them.

I personally would not ever like to take the risk, but thats just me & am sure their are others who have perhaps used these injections with good results?

Would be interesting to hear?

Nina

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I agree that nature should not be interfered with, at the time of Tizzy's injuection she was a foster dog, and I had no say in the matter. I would certainly never use them again.

 

[nina]

I agree that nature should not be interfered with, at the time of Tizzy's injuection she was a foster dog, and I had no say in the matter. I would certainly never use them again.

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Sometimes situations force us to do things we wouldn't really opt for if we had another choice :thumbsup:

At least you can call on this experience now & know firsthand what the pro's & cons are & as you say all the wiser now, you wouldn't use it again.

Good for you

 

[Seraphina]

I started this topic by asking why pyo seems to be so much more prevalent in the UK and USA. I have since spoken to a friend who works in very busy veterinary surgery run by 5 vets. She told me they see one case of pyo about every 3-4 months.

This morning I came across another post asking about panties for bitches in season. I cannot help wondering if putting panties on bitch and therefore preventing her from cleaning herself could in any way contribute to infection?

 

[chelynnah]

The difference in the numbers in the States is possibly just a difference in NUMBERS. There are a LOT more dogs in the US than in the UK and Australia - that's down to geograhpical size as much as anything.

As for panties contributing - I answered that comment on the other post. I certainly don't see how? If anything they're keeping the cervix covered while open, so I would see them as helping to keep infection/bacteria from entering as opposed to contributing. The dogs do get to clean themselves everytime they're let out, and they also have panty-free time in their crates throughout the day.

Wendy

 

[Seraphina]

But the bacteria are already present in the vagina, and the dirty pad being nice and warm wouldn't it be an ideal place for it to grow even faster? Just a food for thought.