Whippet Race In Ireland !

[Martin Tucker]

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For anyone that may be interested in holidaying in Ireland at the beginning of August, Lifford Greyhound Stadium in Co. Donegal are looking for entries to stage a whippet race during their `Festival of Racing Week`. The race is on August 7th over 350 yards, obviously a scratch race. 1st Prize €300, Trophy and Jacket, 2nd Prize €200, 3rd Prize €100 and 3 unplaced prizes of €50 each. Anyone interested in thinking of taking part can contact me and I will give you the tracks details. Lifford is about 120 miles from me, so it`s not my `local`.

martin@irishgreyhoundstud.com

 

[Strike Whippets]

Is it just for pedigree Whippets ??

 

[Mark Roberts]

My mate who lives in Kilkenny mentioned this a few weeks back but didn't have full details.

sounds good though.

 

[Scott Frodsham]

I'd fancy Photo Finish over that distance if it were just peds! :b

 

[Mark Roberts]

get him entered then,

 

[Martin Tucker]

The Whippet race has know become a Lurcher race, I suppose due to lack of interest. Would you Whippet owners out there be interested if I was to organise for next year, a `Derby` at the same venue. Perhaps with a €1,000 First prize. The traps would have to be brought over from England as we would run as a handicap. HEATS, SEMIS and FINAL run on consecutive nights. Would you travel in any numbers to the first ever Irish Whippet Derby ?

 

[Vicky]

Sounds great - if only i had a dog to race

 

[Terry & Sheila Smith]

. Would you travel in any numbers to the first ever Irish Whippet Derby ?

We would have travelled to this one if we had known what exactly was wanted, we have some holidays due around then. The WCRA might not like the sound of a £1000 they don't like the sound of £5.

Personally over 350 yds I don't think there will be that much between the worst & the best in the country.

How about parallel handicaps ped & non-ped ? Split the money, £ 50 no place would have suited us.

Terry Smith

 

[Martin Tucker]

You would still have time Terry if you wanted to come. As regards an event next year, whats wrong with a one off financial incentive to go with a title! Could make for some top quality racing action. Haven`t said anthing to anyone over here yet, as it would be next August, but don`t rule the idea out just yet.

 

[Jacquie]

Great idea Martin

Can't you arrange it for October the month we are coming over :cheers:

 

[tlewis]

You would still have time Terry if you wanted to come. As regards an event next year, whats wrong with a one off financial incentive to go with a title! Could make for some top quality racing action. Haven`t said anthing to anyone over here yet, as it would be next August, but don`t rule the idea out just yet.

For a L 1,000 ($1,800) I might even hop on a plane! You don't mind a spot of Besaps do you?

It's five generations back!!

Just to change the subject a bit. How difficult to use is the progesterone test kit? Is it something the amateur could use? Is it expensive?

I have twenty new greyhound crates standing in a barn here. I bought them five years when my neighbor died. Cost me next to nothing. Why do you think they are superior to the traditional kennel and run? Obviously they utilize the available space better, but what else. Do you have problems with the kennel overheating with a concentration of dogs in crates? Air Conditioning? What do you use as bedding?

 

[Martin Tucker]

Hi Tony.

The progesterone kits are very straight forward. You need to take the blood from a vein and put in a LH bottle and spin down with a centrifuge. You then use the serum for the test. We use the TARGET test which comes from the States.

I only use the `crates` for visiting bitches that are in heat as they tend to settle down a lot easier. I use shredded paper under them. As regards air conditioning. We don`t really get the weather over to warrent such an expense. I just leave all the windows and doors open all the time.

Just curious about your BESAP. What was it`s name and breeding and did it come from the original line that contained AJAX, BULLET, BADGER etc.

Regards.

 

[Vicky]

The progesterone kits are very straight forward. You need to take the blood from a vein and put in a LH bottle and spin down with a centrifuge. You then use the serum for the test. We use the TARGET test which comes from the States.

Martin, would you say they're pretty accurate?

Are the one's you use the dip stick's which go off a colour chart?

 

[Martin Tucker]

Hi Vicky.

We have had terrific results using the tests with `problem` bitches. In fact we put one in pup at the start of the year that was in heat for 35 days !! The majority of bitches will be ready at 14 days. My rule of thum is, `if they break on a Monday, mate on a Monday`. Some go at 12 days, I find this a little early. The blood needs to be very watery, but still a little colour in it.

I always recommend to breeders to stick their bitches on a 5 day course of Antibiotics (Synulox 250mg/day. Costs about a fiver over here over the counter, bet you`ll get ripped off by your Vets over there. Consutation, visit etc !!) prior to mating if they have had a previous litter, as this will clear up any low grade infection the bitch may have. The infection can kill the sperm and could pass an infection onto the stud dog.

There is a superb Vet in Liverpool named Paul Boland, who is red hot on fertility problems in dogs and he has performed a number of surgical implants for me with Frozen Semen from stud dogs in Australia and America, with great results. He will also freeze semen and store it in Liverpool. This would have very useful to the stud dog, whose name escapes me, who had to be castrated a few years ago. Paul has an Progestorone Machine, costs about 45K. It is extreamly accurate and gives an absolute reading in numbers, as opposed to my test which is a colour reading , but not a dip stick. Ours is in like an ink well and turns blue when the bitch is not ready. It gets lighter and lighter as she nears ovulation. When it stays white she is ready.

The last two years I have never seen so many problem bitches. Drying up early or taking the dog late and bleeding very heavy with no obvious change in the colour of the blood. We never seemed to have these problems years ago.

 

[Martin Tucker]

For those of you unfamiliar with surgical implants, check this out.

http://www.thepetcenter.com/sur/ai.html

 

[tlewis]

Martin Turner wrote:

Hi Tony.

>The progesterone kits are very straight forward. You need to take the blood from a vein and put >in a LH bottle and spin down with a centrifuge. You then use the serum for the test. We use the >TARGET test which comes from the States.

---------------------------------------------------

Hi Martin,

It sounds a bit beyond my limited capabilities, not to say expensive if you have to buy a centrifuge as well. I only average a couple of litters a year and as yet, have not had problems getting bitches in whelp. Do you think that breeding at the optimum time in the bitches cycle, as dictated by the pregesterone test, increases the number of pups in a litter? The old adage may be true that the later in the bitches cycle you breed, the more pups you will get in a litter. I tend to breed a bitch the first time she will stand. Obviously pretty early. I'm always afraid that if I wait she may not stand at all!

I used to breed, raise and lease out for racing, Greyhounds under NGA rules. Hard work, a lot of fun, but no great rewards! I got out when the kennel operators that leased my dogs retired. I'm frequently tempted to get back in and raise a litter or two. Usually an easy way to get rid of surplus cash!! At least in the USA!

I have two Besaps bitches in some of my pedigrees. They are Besaps Cockeymoor Geenee and

Besaps Cockeymoor Queeney. Both imported into Canada and supposedly sisters, although they were of very different types and from different litters.

The breeding is given as, Sire: Cockeymoor Flyer and Dam: Cocyeymoor Besaps Rocket. Both these bitches were bred to two of my stud dogs , one of straight English descent and one of English X American descent. The results were very successful on the track and it's difficult to find a successful N.American race Whippet that doesn't have these dogs somewhere in their pedigrees. Obviously they are acceptable to the three racing organizations in the USA and Canada and to the American and Canadian Kennel clubs. These lines have fairly recently been exported to Europe where they are also widely accepted by the various Kennel clubs, racing organizations and the FCI.

And raced with success I might add.

What happened back in 1979 with Besaps seems to me to be pretty irrelevant by now don't you think?

 

[tlewis]

The last two years I have never seen so many problem bitches. Drying up early or taking the dog late and bleeding very heavy with no obvious change in the colour of the blood. We never seemed to have these problems years ago.

Could this be because years ago, before AI, if a bitch was difficult to breed she didn't get bred and would therfore be unable to pass on any inherited breeding problems?

Makes you think! Same with the stud. If he couldn't perform or was a shy breeder he couldn't reproduce these faults. To-day with AI most of these are a thing of the past.

I do think the benifits of AI outweigh the problems. AI has brought huge benefits and improvements in most livestock breeding programs.

AI is still not allowed in race horses in the USA. Don't know about the rest of the World.

 

[Martin Tucker]

Interesting thoughts Tony. In the greyhound world AI is a lot easier for a dog that would be mating 3 or 4 bitches every week, plus you can check out his sperm everytime he is `collected`.

Regarding the breeding of your bitches, COCKEYMORE FLYER- BESAPS ROCKET.

I remember COCKEYMORE FLYER making a big impact on the track at a very young age and siring his first litter I think at around 13 months. Looking back there is no doubt that there was something `dodgy` about the BESAP`S line which had 4 dogs in the Top Ten in what was their first season racing and from a line that nobody had heard of before. ROCKET, MARKWISS, BULLET, HEBE, AJAX, BADGER and DANAWAY DOORMOUSE were the names that hit the tracks. I suspect the mother was a`pedigree` because if they were actual X breds it`s unlikely they would have been beaten, where as the top `pedigree` dogs did give them a fair run for their money.

Obviously with KC papers they could be sold abroad as `Pedigree` whippets and as do the non-pedigree whippets, they would look just like a whippet should. For the `purists` out there though, no matter how far back if they contain BESAP breeding, in their eyes they are not true pedigree dogs. Rightly or wrongly, you wont change their views.

 

[Vicky]

Hi Vicky.
We have had terrific results using the tests with `problem` bitches. In fact we put one in pup at the start of the year that was in heat for 35 days !! The majority of bitches will be ready at 14 days. My rule of thum is, `if they break on a Monday, mate on a Monday`. Some go at 12 days, I find this a little early. The blood needs to be very watery, but still a little colour in it.

I always recommend to breeders to stick their bitches on a 5 day course of Antibiotics (Synulox 250mg/day. Costs about a fiver over here over the counter, bet you`ll get ripped off by your Vets over there. Consutation, visit etc !!) prior to mating if they have had a previous litter, as this will clear up any low grade infection the bitch may have. The infection can kill the sperm and could pass an infection onto the stud dog.

There is a superb Vet in Liverpool named Paul Boland, who is red hot on fertility problems in dogs and he has performed a number of surgical implants for me with Frozen Semen from stud dogs in Australia and America, with great results. He will also freeze semen and store it in Liverpool. This would have very useful to the stud dog, whose name escapes me, who had to be castrated a few years ago. Paul has an Progestorone Machine, costs about 45K. It is extreamly accurate and gives an absolute reading in numbers, as opposed to my test which is a colour reading , but not a dip stick. Ours is in like an ink well and turns blue when the bitch is not ready. It gets lighter and lighter as she nears ovulation. When it stays white she is ready.

The last two years I have never seen so many problem bitches. Drying up early or taking the dog late and bleeding very heavy with no obvious change in the colour of the blood. We never seemed to have these problems years ago.

Thats really interesting Martin thanks for that!

We had been having the ovulation tests done on a bitch from day 17 (dark blue at that point) and again at day 21 (lighter blue), from the test our vet reccomended we mate her within 3-5 days but the bitch's swelling went right down to nothing and no dogs took any interest in her what so ever or vice versa, however she spotted up until 33 days.

Just interested as to how you'd go about it?

Might have to look up Paul Boland next time she breaks as Liverpool is only 3/4 hour from us so may be worth a ride up there.

 

[Martin Tucker]

Had the bitch previous problems in getting in pup ? Also, it`s perhaps wrong of the Vet to tell you to mate in 3-5 days as that test cannot accuratly tell you that far in advance. I would mate her, if possible a number of times (every second day) if you had doubts. Like I previously said, the blood needs to be very thin in colour and watery before they are usually ready. Did you end up getting her covered ?