1 Bitch Bred To 2 Males ... At The Same Time ?

[Ridgesetter]

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Whilst I haven't contemplated this, I don't see a problem. To my knowledge, this procedure has been carried out with zoo and endangered animals for some time.

I know of a litter where 2 males mated a bitch - 1 accidentally - so DNA was carried out and the pups registered accordingly.

Each breeder will make their own decision but if you had an old dog, a dog that was suffering with an illness, a dog with low sperm count or a young unproven dog, and only 1 chance with the bitch, using 2 dogs gives you a greater chance of puppies. There's always a reason behind such a decision, but I'm sure any breeder who undertakes a multiple sire breeding does so with the express wish of getting puppies.

Another thought is that it gives you more diversity in pedigrees for future matings.

What is so good about this is that every puppy is DNA tested. Finally a pedigree will mean something. :thumbsup:

Cheers

 

[sdwhippets]

Just an FYI - we own the dam and both sires of the upcoming litter, they were tested before being bred so that we made sure nothing was transmitted.

Also, the things that Rita posted when she started the discussion was from our website which had not been updated with the new information. When we DO actually do AI's (which is normally if the dogs is having trouble covering the bitch) we collect and do the AI here at home. We planned on breeding one dog naturally and AIing with the other and then reversing the order for the next breeding and so on, giving both stud dogs the chance to cover her naturally - but neither were up for being collected. She was bred naturally to both each day she was bred, not what we 'wanted' to do - but given that neither were up for being collected we had no choice if we wanted to do the dual sired litter. Dido was a VERY easy breeder and had no objections to this method So the breedings were done naturally by both dogs.

Krys

 

[aslan]

Thank you Krys for responding so openly about your dual mating.

I actually think this is a great option - saves the bitch - she only has to have one litter instead of two.

I think the number of puppies matters not regarding quality etc. There have been plenty of matings to single dogs that have produced a disappointing litter of one (or none at all). There are no guarrantees that you will get 7 or 8 pups from a single sire.

I think if I had the money and the option was available to me I think I would do it - I can think of lots of reasons for it - especially in the case of the bitches.

 

[sdwhippets]

Thanks guys for your comments on the litter - We ourselves are very excited about it and can't wait to see what we get - it's an excitment about many things together - #1. Seeing what pups we get, numbers, colors, sexes, etc. #2. Seeing how the ratio actually breaks down with the stud dogs when we DNA. #3. Watching puppies from ONE bitch sired by different fathers growing up together and seeing how they are similar, different, etc.

It's going to be so much fun! Also, we are taking Dido in tomorrow to weigh her and taken an x-ray to see what we got for numbers.

Krys

 

[Quirkyhound]

I rather think it's a brilliant way of saving the bitch from the ordeal of pregnancy, whelping and lactation. If you successfully have two dual litters then you have cut the bitch's whelpings in half, instead of 4 litters she has only had two. With each litter there is always the possibility for the need of a C section or other problem so the fewer litters she has, the fewer problems you should encounter. :thumbsup: If you think of all the unwanted dogs in this world, this could theoretically cut what we produce in half so for that reason, I'd like to see it become the norm here too.

 

[sdwhippets]

That's the way I look at it to - when we breed our girls we normally have an average of 2-3 litters out of them, but with Dido - this may be her only one and we will get bascially two different litters from her!

Mom took her in this morning for an x-ray and from the looks of them, she is going to wait until next week, instead of going this weekend (Sunday is her first due date) and it looks like we have quiet a few - they counted atleast 8! She came home and had a nice breakfast of kibble and cottage cheese and now she is following mom around while she cleans the house

Krys

 

[sdwhippets]

Oh, and she's put on about 9 pounds.

Krys

 

[maggie217]

As there are now have the benefits of DNA testing, and as it seems you have carried out the matings with care, I wish you the very best of luck in this venture and hope you do get puppies from both sires.

 

Very interesting and look forward to hearing more about the resulting litter - or maybe we should say litters?

 

Pauline

 

[sdwhippets]

I am a picture freak, so be prepared to see LOTS of pictures AND I have the web cam hooked up and when the time comes all I have to do is plug it into my laptop and press Go Live and you all can watch the whelping and the puppies growing up! I will post a link to the web cam channel when the time gets a little closer - hopefully she doesn't go like at 3 in the morning so someone other than us can watch the whelping

Dido (aka Diddle) is being really needy since she got back from the vets, probably just because of the break in her routine but she will NOT leave our sides. In her current condition she's been napping a lot but has just paced along behind us since she got back.

Krys

 

[Seraphina]

sdwhippets. did you say when are the puppies due?

 

[sdwhippets]

Her first due date is on Sunday (the 24th) but by the look of the puppies on x-ray she will probably not go until early or middle of next week. We should have pups within the next week or week and a half

For everyone who is interested, we have set up a web cam and I will turn it on (and post when it is turned on so you know) when she starts showing signs of labor. Who knows what time of day or night she will go but even if you miss the whelping, I will keep the cam set up on the puppies so you can watch them The link to where the web cam channel will be is www.live.yahoo.com/ShannonDown

Also, if you sign into your Yahoo account (or make a Yahoo account and sign in) you can chat with everyone watching the cam while you are also watching. I have it set on private so the only people that can watch are people I have sent the link to or have the link - so everyone on there should be Whippet and/or dog people

Krys

 

[sdwhippets]

Dido is starting to get whiny, wants lots of attention and is certainly getting it Pups are rolling around and her whelping area is all set up, though Scarlet (our other pregnant girl that is due early September with a litter of probably just two) is spending more time in it then Dido, but then she's done it before

krys

 

[Canteronboy]

call me old fashioned , BUT i am struggling to get my head round this one.

 

[sdwhippets]

Well, we've already laid out our reasons for doing it - it's not for everyone but it was our decision. For Dido, it's going to be best for her in the long run. If we do get puppies from both sires, it will be like getting two litters in one and we wouldn't want to or have to breed her again down the road which at the moment we have no plans to.

Some people like the idea, some people don't, some people are indifferent to it - but look at it this way - this won't affect a bitch any differently then if she was bred to one dog - she is having one litter (and breeding her to one dog will not increase the number of puppies she has unless one particular dog has a low sperm count, the other dog will just fill in the gap that was left) so it's not affecting her any differently then if we just bred her to one dog. The only thing that has changed from breeding her to one dog to two dogs is that we have to do DNA testing on the pups - which will not affect the puppies but will affect our bank account, but we are willing to do that.

We have no problems with everyone discussing their opinions about this or even our litter in particular, it's a good discussion to have and we expected it to happen anyways

Krys

 

[sdwhippets]

For those interested, I am posting a new picture on our blog of Dido with her full belly that I just took a bit ago. Here is the link... www.shannondown.blogspot.com

When she has the pups, the blog and website will be updated with tons of photos

Krys

 

[Sarsanet]

For those interested, I am posting a new picture on our blog of Dido with her full belly that I just took a bit ago.  Here is the link... www.shannondown.blogspot.com
When she has the pups, the blog and website will be updated with tons of photos

Krys

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I'm finding this topic really interesting & am even toying with the idea myself. In the wild bitches would mate, unsupervised, with any male, even her own relatives, so I see no reason why it shouldn't be done supervised & with DNA assistance for registration.

I wish you the very best of luck with it & am looking forward to seeing/hearing about the results. Please post some pictures here, won't you? Fiddling with Yahoo & blogs & live pictures is all too much for me & my poor old computer!

 

[sdwhippets]

I tried to post a photo the other day but it wouldn't let me - I haven't used a forum like this before so I have no clue If someone could give me a pointer and tell me how I can post a photo, I would love to I tried the 'Add This Attachment' thing but it said that my total filespace required to upload the attached file is greater than my per post or global limit. I tried reducing the photo so it was tiny and it still wouldn't work

Krys

 

[T Hoare]

I tried to post a photo the other day but it wouldn't let me - I haven't used a forum like this before so I have no clue   If someone could give me a pointer and tell me how I can post a photo, I would love to   I tried the 'Add This Attachment' thing but it said that my total filespace required to upload the attached file is greater than my per post or global limit.  I tried reducing the photo so it was tiny and it still wouldn't work
Krys

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If you use photobucket to resize photo you shouldn't have a problem. i use the 640 x 480 size.

 

[Hebridean]

call me old fashioned , BUT i am struggling to get my head round this one.

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Same here.

 

[Envyme]

Well, we've already laid out our reasons for doing it - it's not for everyone but it was our decision.  For Dido, it's going to be best for her in the long run.  If we do get puppies from both sires, it will be like getting two litters in one and we wouldn't want to or have to breed her again down the road which at the moment we have no plans to. 
Some people like the idea, some people don't, some people are indifferent to it - but look at it this way - this won't affect a bitch any differently then if she was bred to one dog - she is having one litter (and breeding her to one dog will not increase the number of puppies she has unless one particular dog has a low sperm count, the other dog will just fill in the gap that was left) so it's not affecting her any differently then if we just bred her to one dog.  The only thing that has changed from breeding her to one dog to two dogs is that we have to do DNA testing on the pups - which will not affect the puppies but will affect our bank account, but we are willing to do that. 

We have no problems with everyone discussing their opinions about this or even our litter in particular, it's a good discussion to have and we expected it to happen anyways

Krys

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Just wanted to wish you luck with your forth coming litter. How incredibly exciting & i for one really think this is the way forward, excellent idea & works well for all parties concerned including the bitch.

Hopefully it will become an acceptable way of breeding here as well by the more conscientious breeder.

Look forward to seeing the web cam & i'm sure both sets of pups will be stunning.

Well done on such an exciting & innovative breeding prospect :luck: :cheers: