Advice Please. Warring Whippets.

[joannea]

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Something horrible happened today. Two of our three dogs had a serious fight. They are both female, and the other one is male, and had the sense to keep clear of the action. The younger one, winnie, is just coming up to her second season, which is undoubtedly part of the problem. She is normally completely passive and never stands up for herself, but is a bit more stubborn than usual at the moment. She is nearly always in bed with Bella every morning, and they dote on each other. Fortunately, neither needed stitches, although we still had a whopping vets bill for an out of hours call out, but any advice on how to get them to make up and prevent a repeat be much appreciated. Neither has been spayed. They are in the same room at the moment. Bella looked like she was ready to have a go when Winnie tried to get onto the sofa, so we put Winnie in a bed on the floor, and now there is an uneasy truce. Joanne

 

[pat cope]

I think it is a dominance issue. I have a multi dog family, 13 altogether all living in the house, dogs

and bitches, some neutered some entire.

Most of the time they get along fine but I am careful not to leave them unsupervised as arguments

can break out for no reason. Usually over who wants to be on the best chair or maybe they want the

same toy!!!! Bit like kids really but with teeth !!!!

Hope you sort it out.

 

[bertha]

Been there, done that as have lots of us. It's not easy. I have ended up after a particularly horrendous fight ending up having the perpetrator PTS as he broke the other dogs jaw. I just couldn't live with them fighting like that. I have re-homed trouble makers and they have been fine in new homes.

Bitches are worse than dogs for bearing a grudge. It can only get worse I am afraid.

My advice would be to part with the dog that starts it, if you can bear it. Not easy. Spaying the dominant dog might help.

I don't envy you, it is a difficult place to be.

:wub:

 

[spottydog]

FOR MY MIND THAT IS NOT LOGICAL YOU SHOULD ALLWAYS SPEYE THE LEAST DOMINANT BITCH SO THERE LEVEL OF STATUS IS MORE GREATLY SEPERATED THAT WAY THERE IS LESS TO FIGHT ABOUT IF YOU SPEYE ALPHA BITCH YOU ARE RELEGATING HER TO A LEVEL WHERE THEY CAN NEVER RESOLVE THEIR STRUGGLE FOR DOMINANCE. THERE HAS TO BE AN ALPHA BITCH SO MAKE IT EASY FOR THE BITCH THAT ALREADY IS ASSUMING THAT POSITION. HOPE THIS HELPS & MAKES SENCE SEEN IT WORK COUNTLESS TIMES :luck: :luck: :luck:

 

[wild whippies]

FOR MY MIND THAT IS NOT LOGICAL YOU SHOULD ALLWAYS SPEYE THE LEAST DOMINANT BITCH SO THERE LEVEL OF STATUS IS MORE GREATLY SEPERATED THAT WAY THERE IS LESS TO FIGHT ABOUT IF YOU SPEYE ALPHA BITCH YOU ARE RELEGATING HER TO A LEVEL WHERE THEY CAN NEVER RESOLVE THEIR STRUGGLE FOR DOMINANCE. THERE HAS TO BE AN ALPHA BITCH SO MAKE IT EASY FOR THE BITCH THAT ALREADY IS ASSUMING THAT POSITION. HOPE THIS HELPS & MAKES SENCE SEEN IT WORK COUNTLESS TIMES :luck: :luck: :luck:

Alpha bitch in our household is me!

We have 21 dogs 10 of them are bitches none of them are speyed and the 11 males aren't either. We just won't tolerate aggresion between the pack and for that reason it rarely happens.

 

[TTT]

FOR MY MIND THAT IS NOT LOGICAL YOU SHOULD ALLWAYS SPEYE THE LEAST DOMINANT BITCH SO THERE LEVEL OF STATUS IS MORE GREATLY SEPERATED THAT WAY THERE IS LESS TO FIGHT ABOUT IF YOU SPEYE ALPHA BITCH YOU ARE RELEGATING HER TO A LEVEL WHERE THEY CAN NEVER RESOLVE THEIR STRUGGLE FOR DOMINANCE. THERE HAS TO BE AN ALPHA BITCH SO MAKE IT EASY FOR THE BITCH THAT ALREADY IS ASSUMING THAT POSITION. HOPE THIS HELPS & MAKES SENCE SEEN IT WORK COUNTLESS TIMES :luck: :luck: :luck:

Alpha bitch in our household is me!

We have 21 dogs 10 of them are bitches none of them are speyed and the 11 males aren't either. We just won't tolerate aggresion between the pack and for that reason it rarely happens.

That is a lot of dogs to keep under the thumb :blink: . What way do you house them to keep them safe?

 

[jayp]

FOR MY MIND THAT IS NOT LOGICAL YOU SHOULD ALLWAYS SPEYE THE LEAST DOMINANT BITCH SO THERE LEVEL OF STATUS IS MORE GREATLY SEPERATED THAT WAY THERE IS LESS TO FIGHT ABOUT IF YOU SPEYE ALPHA BITCH YOU ARE RELEGATING HER TO A LEVEL WHERE THEY CAN NEVER RESOLVE THEIR STRUGGLE FOR DOMINANCE. THERE HAS TO BE AN ALPHA BITCH SO MAKE IT EASY FOR THE BITCH THAT ALREADY IS ASSUMING THAT POSITION. HOPE THIS HELPS & MAKES SENCE SEEN IT WORK COUNTLESS TIMES :luck: :luck: :luck:

Alpha bitch in our household is me!

We have 21 dogs 10 of them are bitches none of them are speyed and the 11 males aren't either. We just won't tolerate aggresion between the pack and for that reason it rarely happens.

Good reply....zero tolerance to mounting, growling , guarding ...all from day one.

 

[Hula]

Sometimes its difficult to tell who is starting the trouble . With dogs so much of their communication is about body language . Some of it is very subtle . I have here the master of annoying body language . She stands and looks at the others a certain way and they find it very annoying . This usually results in them charging at her from their bed etc . They may look like the trouble maker but I know she has started it .

There is zero tolerance to any form of aggression in this house too . No dog is top dog here they are all treated equally .

I would certainly not consider parting with any of them on the basis of this one fight . I only ever keep bitches ., they are all spayed eventually . I have never had any problem with aggression I could not deal with .

 

[TTT]

I think in reality, no matter how much we say 'we are the boss' and don't tolerate bold behaviour etc, in a multi-dog situation,fights can break out in a split second over something and nothing. When I am not immediately available to monitor my dogs, I make sure they are separated in crates and behind baby gates etc. That way, they can still see each other and communicate but without the risk of coming home to a seriously injured, or indeed, a dead dog.

 

[bertha]

21 dogs in one house!!!!!!!!!! How do you manage? That is like having a kennels, are you allowed that many????? Just being nosey. I cannot imagine being allowed to do that where we live.

Managing a pack is a full time job, fighting can really upset the pack. I know some people advocate leaving the dogs to sort it out, it may work, but the blood bath if it doesn't is not worth the risk IMO.

 

[Trish]

FOR MY MIND THAT IS NOT LOGICAL YOU SHOULD ALLWAYS SPEYE THE LEAST DOMINANT BITCH SO THERE LEVEL OF STATUS IS MORE GREATLY SEPERATED THAT WAY THERE IS LESS TO FIGHT ABOUT IF YOU SPEYE ALPHA BITCH YOU ARE RELEGATING HER TO A LEVEL WHERE THEY CAN NEVER RESOLVE THEIR STRUGGLE FOR DOMINANCE. THERE HAS TO BE AN ALPHA BITCH SO MAKE IT EASY FOR THE BITCH THAT ALREADY IS ASSUMING THAT POSITION. HOPE THIS HELPS & MAKES SENCE SEEN IT WORK COUNTLESS TIMES :luck: :luck: :luck:

Alpha bitch in our household is me!

We have 21 dogs 10 of them are bitches none of them are speyed and the 11 males aren't either. We just won't tolerate aggresion between the pack and for that reason it rarely happens.

Same here , im the alpha bitch in this house , i only have to click my fingers and point to the dog that needs putting in check for a positive reaction .

You do need to notice a change in their body language so quick to diffuse any situation that might be about to flare up and im pretty good at that .

We have 9 here 2 bitches (speyed) and 7 entire dogs , all get on really well most of the time .

 

[gypsysmum]

Fighting bitches who really fall out will fight to the death. Dogs, on the other hand, make a lot of noise and bluster but one will usually back down.

I would never leave them alone together. Just watch them very carefully and if it keeps happening then, as has been said above, you may end up having to rehome one of them

 

[joannea]

Fighting bitches who really fall out will fight to the death. Dogs, on the other hand, make a lot of noise and bluster but one will usually back down.I would never leave them alone together. Just watch them very carefully and if it keeps happening then, as has been said above, you may end up having to rehome one of them

I am certainly keeping a very close eye on them, and they are both sleeping in cages. Poor little Winnie is very frightened and giving Bella a very wide berth but on the positive side, there doesn't seem to be any dispute over who is top dog. In fact, i doubt whether there was ever a serious challenge from winnie as she is so incredibly meek, but who knows what triggers these things. On their first walk together post fight, Bella mounted winnie's head a couple of times and Winnie just stood there shaking. Bella seemed quite satisfied with this reaction, and has backed off a bit since. Yesterday, Winnie was too scared to come all the way downstairs when i called them for dinner and Bella started crying at the bottom of the stairs, then went up and shepherded Winnie down and they both trotted into the kitchen with their tails wagging. I daresay it will take them a while to trust each other again, but I am keeping my fingers crossed. The male dog seems completely oblivious to any atmosphere and is behaving absolutely normally.

 

[wild whippies]

Fighting bitches who really fall out will fight to the death. Dogs, on the other hand, make a lot of noise and bluster but one will usually back down.I would never leave them alone together. Just watch them very carefully and if it keeps happening then, as has been said above, you may end up having to rehome one of them

I am certainly keeping a very close eye on them, and they are both sleeping in cages. Poor little Winnie is very frightened and giving Bella a very wide berth but on the positive side, there doesn't seem to be any dispute over who is top dog. In fact, i doubt whether there was ever a serious challenge from winnie as she is so incredibly meek, but who knows what triggers these things. On their first walk together post fight, Bella mounted winnie's head a couple of times and Winnie just stood there shaking. Bella seemed quite satisfied with this reaction, and has backed off a bit since. Yesterday, Winnie was too scared to come all the way downstairs when i called them for dinner and Bella started crying at the bottom of the stairs, then went up and shepherded Winnie down and they both trotted into the kitchen with their tails wagging. I daresay it will take them a while to trust each other again, but I am keeping my fingers crossed. The male dog seems completely oblivious to any atmosphere and is behaving absolutely normally.

The male is unlikely to display aggresion purely because of there being 2 females and no-one to challenge his hareem. (I say unlikely but I have heard of males who have been aggresive to females but general it's a rarity) I personally do feel you shouldn't allow Bella to dominate Winnie which is what's occuring with her mounting. Winnie needs the reassurance that when your not there, she is safe from harm by crating like your already doing. She also needs reassurance that she won't come to any harm when your around as well too and that would be for my by reprimanding Bella for bullying Winnie.

I note some are are somewhat shocked by how many dogs we have. Whilst I don't see what any business it is of there's I would like to point out that our circumstances aren't like theirs and therefore presumptions shouldn't be made.

Those that do know us well, Trish being one of those who knows both us and our dogs knows exactly how commited we are. (w00t)

 

[Trish]

Fighting bitches who really fall out will fight to the death. Dogs, on the other hand, make a lot of noise and bluster but one will usually back down.I would never leave them alone together. Just watch them very carefully and if it keeps happening then, as has been said above, you may end up having to rehome one of them

I am certainly keeping a very close eye on them, and they are both sleeping in cages. Poor little Winnie is very frightened and giving Bella a very wide berth but on the positive side, there doesn't seem to be any dispute over who is top dog. In fact, i doubt whether there was ever a serious challenge from winnie as she is so incredibly meek, but who knows what triggers these things. On their first walk together post fight, Bella mounted winnie's head a couple of times and Winnie just stood there shaking. Bella seemed quite satisfied with this reaction, and has backed off a bit since. Yesterday, Winnie was too scared to come all the way downstairs when i called them for dinner and Bella started crying at the bottom of the stairs, then went up and shepherded Winnie down and they both trotted into the kitchen with their tails wagging. I daresay it will take them a while to trust each other again, but I am keeping my fingers crossed. The male dog seems completely oblivious to any atmosphere and is behaving absolutely normally.

The male is unlikely to display aggresion purely because of there being 2 females and no-one to challenge his hareem. (I say unlikely but I have heard of males who have been aggresive to females but general it's a rarity) I personally do feel you shouldn't allow Bella to dominate Winnie which is what's occuring with her mounting. Winnie needs the reassurance that when your not there, she is safe from harm by crating like your already doing. She also needs reassurance that she won't come to any harm when your around as well too and that would be for my by reprimanding Bella for bullying Winnie.

I note some are are somewhat shocked by how many dogs we have. Whilst I don't see what any business it is of there's I would like to point out that our circumstances aren't like theirs and therefore presumptions shouldn't be made.

Those that do know us well, Trish being one of those who knows both us and our dogs knows exactly how commited we are. (w00t)

:thumbsup: ....

 

[TTT]

Fighting bitches who really fall out will fight to the death. Dogs, on the other hand, make a lot of noise and bluster but one will usually back down.I would never leave them alone together. Just watch them very carefully and if it keeps happening then, as has been said above, you may end up having to rehome one of them

I am certainly keeping a very close eye on them, and they are both sleeping in cages. Poor little Winnie is very frightened and giving Bella a very wide berth but on the positive side, there doesn't seem to be any dispute over who is top dog. In fact, i doubt whether there was ever a serious challenge from winnie as she is so incredibly meek, but who knows what triggers these things. On their first walk together post fight, Bella mounted winnie's head a couple of times and Winnie just stood there shaking. Bella seemed quite satisfied with this reaction, and has backed off a bit since. Yesterday, Winnie was too scared to come all the way downstairs when i called them for dinner and Bella started crying at the bottom of the stairs, then went up and shepherded Winnie down and they both trotted into the kitchen with their tails wagging. I daresay it will take them a while to trust each other again, but I am keeping my fingers crossed. The male dog seems completely oblivious to any atmosphere and is behaving absolutely normally.

The male is unlikely to display aggresion purely because of there being 2 females and no-one to challenge his hareem. (I say unlikely but I have heard of males who have been aggresive to females but general it's a rarity) I personally do feel you shouldn't allow Bella to dominate Winnie which is what's occuring with her mounting. Winnie needs the reassurance that when your not there, she is safe from harm by crating like your already doing. She also needs reassurance that she won't come to any harm when your around as well too and that would be for my by reprimanding Bella for bullying Winnie.

I note some are are somewhat shocked by how many dogs we have. Whilst I don't see what any business it is of there's I would like to point out that our circumstances aren't like theirs and therefore presumptions shouldn't be made.Those that do know us well, Trish being one of those who knows both us and our dogs knows exactly how commited we are. (w00t)

Regarding the number of dogs that you choose to have - that is, of course, your own decision. The discussion is about problems in a multi-dog situation, on which you, amonst others, offered advice. Most folks have nowhere near the number you have, so of course they may find it interesting to know how you manage/house them all harmoniously?

 

[JAX]

Ive 10 whippets , 8 bitches , 4 spayed , 4 not spayed ( obviously LOL)2 males one entire.

IMO spaying makes NO differance at all , Ive had battles in the past with 2 spayed bitches , who now at 11 years of age , still give each other the `odd look` but thats all.

My recommendation would be never to leave Winnie alone wth your dominant girl , esp during seaonal times when hormones are at the fore .

I can spot my trouble maker by her eyes and body language and stop her with a few words and MY body language ,

Shes never left alone with the one she likes to pick on and when I exercise her with any of the others shes muzzled , cos if any one accidently bumps into her , she goes into attack mod.Never full attack because I think she knows nothing can be done because she has a muzzle on. Its best stopped before it begins IMO

Some might think muzzles are cruel , but dogs get used to them just like they did a collar ( Im an ex racing greyhound person , so its natural I think nothing of muzzling my dog.

The main thing is that YOU dont feel nervous about the 2 girls being togther . as they will sence your nerves , try relaxing as if nothing as happened giving both girl the same amount of love ( im sure you do , and what about your boy ! Bless him , , whippet boys are really something else arnt they

Good luck with your girls :luck:

 

[joannea]

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who replied to my original post and to let you know how things were going. Just as we thought things were getting better, there was a second fight and Bella's leg ended up needing stitches. My husband unwisely tried to break up the fight and ended up getting bitten too. I spoke to an animal behaviourist recommended by the vet, who suggested a few strategies to try before going down the rehoming route. The dogs are now wearing their racing muzzles most of the time (my idea as these don't seem to bother them), sleeping in cages, but staying together, so that we can keep things as normal as possible for them while not getting too stressed ourselves and making things even worse. She agreed with the advice not to let Bella dominate Winnie and we have a blanket and a bucket of water at the ready in case we do need to break up a fight. They are also both being spayed today. We were going to get Bella done before any of this happened and as she needed an GA for her leg, the vet offered to do it at the same time. I discussed with the behaviourist the question of which dog to spay. Her advice was that while it wasn't guaranteed to work, we needed to spay both rather than just one. Apparently neutering the underdog and leaving the alpha dog only works on dogs, not bitches (that's the current thinking, anyway). Just waiting for the call to go and pick them up. I really do appreciate everyone's advice. It's been a pretty stressful week and it's been some comfort to know that others have managed to get through similar situations.

 

[JAX]

So sorry to hear this , hope Hubby isnt too badly bitten. Its a natural instinct to try and split them up ,

The times mine have `been at it `its always the same two girls ( both spayed , but one has a disability in that shes had a her back operated on so is a `weak` link ) and I know how to react , no screaming , shouting , hitting or whatever , keep as calm as is possible and just wait for the moment you can split them up. Of course with having 10 whippets !!!! the others can get instited to join in , luckily ive managed to keep everything under control ( fingers crossed ) , Some of the `gang`just get out of the room or where ever the ding dong is happening.

if they are happy wearing muzzles thats the way to go forward for now.

 

[lorna anne]

Often it is a case of us treating our dogs like people and then being shocked when they behave like dogs

While I am around, I am boss dog - and all my dogs know this. I am in charge of all the resources (attention, cuddles, food, walks, treats, outings in the car, warm beds, etc, etc) therefore they realise it is best to stay on my good side . I am also extremely tuned into the body language of my dogs - I think my "whippetspeak" is better than my English.

I would never leave my 12 whippets to run free unsupervised. If I am not there to supervise I have areas where I can keep them separately. I have been VERY fortunate not to have had a barney, but I am awfully aware of how quickly things can spiral out of control. Especially if all the dogs join in a fight it can be absolutely dreadfully horrendous. I would never run the risk of this happening. Something innocent like chasing a bird or a boisterous game can quickly become nasty.

Unfortunately once two dogs have had a serious disagreement, the vibes between them tend never to be the same again. This is why I put SO much emphasis on PREVENTION.

All the best to owners with multi-dog households. It takes skill and devotion to manage a large number of dogs, but the rewards far outweigh the sacrifices.

Lorna