Frozen Semen Ai Success

[Scudder]

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Last time I was looking into importing semen and was going through the requirements on our Quarantine Services website, one of the thing that I recall was that the container has to be new and cannot be hired anymore.

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I would be interested in knowing if that is still true from anyone who has recently imported frozen semen from the US.

For domestic inseminations, we pay a fee for the container rental and as long as it is returned to the facility within a certain time frame (7-14 days after shipping usually) there is no additional fee. The penalties for not returning a container on time are pretty steep.

The vet where Pea was inseminated has their own storage tanks and transferred the frozen semen into their units and promtly returned the container.

Kristen

 

[GotWhippet?]

I don't know if it was a hired container or not. We imported the semen in September of 2007. It was a SHARED container which cut the cost right down. All up it was approx 2k, shipped from the west coast (not including the stud fee arrangement with the owners which remains between me and them).

You have to pay a yearly storage fee. Ours is with Monash, costing $54 per year all up which is pretty good. To add we will have the progesterone tests and surgical implant to come, plus praying to the puppy gods that we get a bitch in whelp. We have known Michael Bell for over 18 yrs and he deals alot in frozen semen for the greys, I had a talk to him about the whips and he believes they should be no different. I got vials but he recommended pellets. I'll go the camelot method next time if I decide to go through all that stress again.

 

[seaspot_run]

Pea was inseminated with pellets.

The cost of the shipping container rental, plus shipping, plus lab fee for the technicians at the center to pull and package the requested pellets came to $375 US.

But Federal Express blew the shipping and ended up not getting in there overnight as promised but in two days. So, I got $100 back from Fed Ex!!!

The stuff stays frozen for up to 7 days in their container, so it was no problem as we had gotten in there early anyway.

 

[Seraphina]

Link to AQIS

semen import

Maybe it was the vet who told me container hire was no longer an option? Cannot remember.

 

[05whippet]

Last time I was looking into importing semen and was going through the requirements on our Quarantine Services website, one of the thing that I recall was that the container has to be new and cannot be hired anymore.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

I would be interested in knowing if that is still true from anyone who has recently imported frozen semen from the US.

For domestic inseminations, we pay a fee for the container rental and as long as it is returned to the facility within a certain time frame (7-14 days after shipping usually) there is no additional fee. The penalties for not returning a container on time are pretty steep.

The vet where Pea was inseminated has their own storage tanks and transferred the frozen semen into their units and promtly returned the container.

Kristen

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Hi Kristen,

As far as am aware you can still "hire" the vapor shipper....I imported frozen semen from the US into the UK last June & hired the shipper then. The total cost of shipping to the UK including preparation,vapor shipper rental & freight charges etc (using Fed Ex) came to £320 (that does not include the price of the straws).

Pamela.

 

[Seraphina]

As far as am aware you can still "hire" the vapor shipper....I imported frozen semen from the US into the UK last June & hired the shipper then. The total cost of shipping to the UK including preparation,vapor shipper rental & freight charges etc (using Fed Ex) came to £320 (that does not include the price of the straws).
Pamela.

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Maybe because Australia is so far, and the container would have to travel back empty as there may not be much semen going the other way, is what would make it uneconomical??? Or it may have been just this particular company. I did not question it, as I was not shopping around for the cheapest way to do it.

 

[Ms Molly]

You are able to hire a canister. However there has to be documented proof of the cleansing of the unit.

I know Dogtainers can arrange the shipping, and know all the lurks and perks.

Molly

 

[05whippet]

As far as am aware you can still "hire" the vapor shipper....I imported frozen semen from the US into the UK last June & hired the shipper then. The total cost of shipping to the UK including preparation,vapor shipper rental & freight charges etc (using Fed Ex) came to £320 (that does not include the price of the straws).
Pamela.

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Maybe because Australia is so far, and the container would have to travel back empty as there may not be much semen going the other way, is what would make it uneconomical??? Or it may have been just this particular company. I did not question it, as I was not shopping around for the cheapest way to do it.

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Hi Seraphina,

I hired the vapor shipper through Synbiotics in the US,that is where the semen came from and it went back empty...it was cheaper to ship it back! I guess maybe it was that particular company's policy & that is why they would not let you hire a shipper? I suppose everyone's different.

Pamela.

 

[patsy]

As far as am aware you can still "hire" the vapor shipper....I imported frozen semen from the US into the UK last June & hired the shipper then. The total cost of shipping to the UK including preparation,vapor shipper rental & freight charges etc (using Fed Ex) came to £320 (that does not include the price of the straws).
Pamela.

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​

Maybe because Australia is so far, and the container would have to travel back empty as there may not be much semen going the other way, is what would make it uneconomical??? Or it may have been just this particular company. I did not question it, as I was not shopping around for the cheapest way to do it.

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​

Hi Seraphina,

I hired the vapor shipper through Synbiotics in the US,that is where the semen came from and it went back empty...it was cheaper to ship it back! I guess maybe it was that particular company's policy & that is why they would not let you hire a shipper? I suppose everyone's different.

Pamela.

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I have heard that pellets are very successful.

 

[elmaro]

Just seen this post ... our sucessful AI litters (dobermanns not whippets mind you) were all with pellets ... the straws we have are useless!!!

If a vet gave me a choice I'd go with the pellet option every time.

Can someone shed some light for me as to whether semen collection in the UK and europe is as easily done compared to the US?

Cheers

Elly

 

[patsy]

Just seen this post  ... our sucessful AI litters (dobermanns not whippets mind you) were all with pellets ... the straws we have are useless!!!
If a vet gave me a choice I'd go with the pellet option every time. 

Can someone shed some light for me as to whether semen collection in the UK and europe is as easily done compared to the US?

Cheers

Elly

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Good in the Uk there is a vet in Liverpool, who shows Staffordshire Bull Terriers he was one of the first to use pellets with great success.

 

[BlackMoon Magic]

i have had a whippet implanted from a frozen straw, though the straw was from a dog here in oz not over seas. she had 10 puppies! i couldn't believe it!

 

[Ridgesetter]

I've not done frozen AI with whippets as I have been told that it is not as successful in sighthounds as it is in other dogs (and this was from Greyhound breeders as well). I do know of the odd sighthound litter born by frozen semen but they don't seem to have been as many as there are in other 'normal' breeds. However, times change, experience improves, so that view might have.

RR's have been using frozen semen very successfully here in Oz for many years but I did have a 'disaster' after importing straws years ago so I've never been game to repeat the exercise (or the financial loss!)

A lister posted that their vet recommends bitches that have produced a litter. One of our major breeder vets who does quite a bit of frozen AI here in Sydney recommends maiden bitches. Why? Because she says the uterus is clean and she finds a better success rate with maidens.

Most vets who do frozen inseminations will give you their success rate.

This field is constantly changing and evolving so I think I'll just stick to watching the deed done in the backyard. :thumbsup:

Cheers

 

[Skiska]

Hi all,

 

I have imported semen from Europe (not for whippets) the first time 7 bitches were inseminated by 3 of the top AI vets in Australia at the time and one 1 bitch took and she had a good sized litter, on the other hand I have exported semen to Europe and every time it has been used a litter has resulted the smallest litter size being 1 pup.

 

My second venture into importing semen was a co venture and the semen has been used once with a litter resulting (YEAH).

 

When exporting semen I am very fair they get enough for 2 matings they pay the stud fee for 1 mating and all the costs and that's it if the get 1 litter or 2 litters good for them if they get no litters (which at this stage has never happened) I am sorry but that's the luck of the draw.

 

But when importing you try and explain to anyone in Europe that we do not get $2,000 a pup they think we are crazy infact one RR breeder in Europe said I was lying!

Ai has its pros and cons but in the long run its worth it, maybe not in the immediate progeny but they are very good as grand parents

 

Regards

Leanne

 

[Skiska]

Hi Toni,

What they mean by a clean uterus is yes a maiden but also doing a back to back mating on an older btich doing the AI on the second mating gives you a clean uterus

Regards

Leanne

 

[Skiska]

Hi Elly,

I don't think that its the collection that is the problem here I think it the many different ways they thaw the semen and the thawing/ freezing agents.

Regards

Leanne

 

[seaspot_run]

Here's a brief rundown of other replies I received on whippetsanity, a US e-mail list:

**INTERLUDE WHIPPETS IN QUEBEC had a litter of 8 about three years ago from frozen semen owned by Pat Miller Semen had been in storage around 10 years. Insemination done at the clinic where the semen was stored so no shipping involved.

 

**1) How many pups resulted? 7

2) How old was the semen (i.e. when was it collected?) aprox. 9 years

3) Did you use a repro specialist or a general practice veterinarian? General practice

4) Surgical implant or transcervical? Surgical

5) Motility/viability of the semen if you recall it or were told? Don’t remember the percentage, but both were good

6) Number of prosterone tests performed prior to implantation 1, the bitch had started in season, and the plan was to do a series of tests, but after the first one the Vet recommended doing the implant right away.

 

 

 

Due to the presence of ICSB (International Canine Semen Bank) in this area, we might be more fortunate than others. Dr Carrol Platz has been at the forefront of using frozen semen http://www.ik9sb.com/, and there are a number of general practice vets who have worked with him and are quite capable.

 

 

 

As a side note, I am aware of some discussion among I.G. breeders who have generally felt that their breed was not viable for using frozen semen……it just didn’t work is what they felt. Well recently there have been 2 successful litters born, which has lead to the type of discussion on your Australian list. Personally I believe while there are a number of factors to co-ordinate, frozen breeding are a reasonable option.

**Hi Karen

 

We have done a couple of frozen semen litters and have had good success with both.

Here are our answers to your questions you posted on whippetsanity .

 

1) our 2001 litter resulted in 4 puppies and our 2004 litter resulted in 6 puppies.

2) litter #1 the semen was collected in 1998, and litter 2 the semen was collected in 2001 or 2002 ( I think).

3) used the same repro vet for both litters and both were implanted surgically.

4) wasn't told the exact numbers, but for the first litter she did tell us that viability of the sperm was at about 55% and the motility wasn't as active as what she would would normally like to see it and she rated the sperm for the second litter at 95% and very active.

5) first litter was 5 progesterone tests prior to implantation and the second litter was 3 progesterone tests

Consensus seems to be:

A) Don't skimp on the progesterone testing!!!

and

B) Use a repro specialist, not a regular vet.

and

C) Surgically implant frozen--always.

Hope this helps some of you get the frozen semen success you want if you choose to go that route. This is not an inexpensive way to breed, but it may be a way to get some outside blood which would otherwise be unavailable, so every so often, I think I might be up for doing it again. I'd certainly use sperm with a higher motility/viability, though. I would ask to have a pellet sampled before my bitch was ever in heat and I made that sort of commitment.

 

[Ridgesetter]

Regular vets don't do frozen inseminations - or at least here in Oz they don't.

Progesterone assays are a given test. Many breeders already do prog tests for normal matings. When you're hopping in a car and driving 14 hours to a stud dog, you want to know that you're not too early - or too late.

Following our experience (collecting from a dog over 7 years of age following an illness which we were unaware of), our semen was viable but no success on 3 bitches. We did a Zone Polusida test in Monash University who at the time advised the enzyme head of the semen had altered and the semen would have difficulty penetrating an ova (or that's the simple version). The vet we were using for the insemination advised us he didn't recommend collecting from dogs over 6.5 years of age as this problem is more likely to occur. (I understand the same thing happens in humans.) So if collecting a dog, we were told optimum time is around 4-5 years of age.

The problem with this whole area is you are comparing apples to oranges - straws to pellets; different diluents, some vets will only surgically implant where others do transcervical, different vets, different breeds, amount of transportation involved, etc. I guess I'm saying that comparing one success of say 6 years ago is not really comparible to an insemination done today as the storage and methods have improved.

I am also hearing of dogs being fed supplements to improve / increase semen - Boost. A friend is doing this at the moment. Viable semen was sent o/s and no litter resulted. This opens debate - should stud owners inform buyers of this? :- "

As for a clean uterus, I have heard this from a couple of AI specialist vets and they say if a bitch has had a caesar, infection or a problem in a prior whelping, there MAY be scar tissue present and this may inhibit the success of insemination. This is why she prefers a maiden bitch and is a view I have heard the same view from other specialists.

Regards

 

[seaspot_run]

The issue with a maiden bitch is that you have no idea what her typical fertility is--i.e. how many eggs she generally ovulates and how good her uterus is. There are maiden bitches who never successfully conceive and carry to term no matter how they are bred because they don't produce the right hormonal profile to maintain a pregnancy. And, if you are dealing with frozen semen which isn't optimal, and you have a bitch who would typically have 3-4 from a natural cover mating, you've really reduced your odds of getting anything at all.

If you do surgical, the implanting veterinarian can look at the overall condition of the uterus and even break up manually any adhesions or other barriers which might be a problem. When my bitch was implanted, she'd had two prior litters, both of them quite large, and her uterus was pronounced to be in superb condition, very smooth and the lining looked right throughout. It's nice to know what you're dealing with.

I would say that if the frozen is simply a matter of getting a dog who is still alive and currently siring and from whom more straws/pellets can be collected, then a maiden bitch MIGHT be worth a chance, but there is no way I would recommend that a bitch who hasn't already proven her ability to carry a large litter to term and whelp it successfully should be tried with valuable old frozen semen from a dog who is no longer able to be collected, if that semen is of limited quantity to begin with. You risk wasting a breeding that another breeder with a different bitch could use and get some puppies.

Karen Lee

 

[belge]

Molly asked

There is a thread ongoing on this list at present about the success of using imported frozen semen in Whippets.
Is it possible for our list members  to help us out in informing us of all the litters known to have been born on all continents, and what the percentage success ratio is,  compared to the failure rate.

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I imported two lots of frozen whippet semen 10 years ago. The first lot was not viable when thawed after bringing it to New Zealand. When that semen turned out a dud, I had my bitch inseminated with the other semen from a German bred dog. No litter eventuated. I haven't used the remained of that semen but am not holding my breath.

Two years ago, I imported frozen semen from a Dutch Groenendael and used it last year (on my French bred Groenendael bitch). The semen was surgically implanted which resulted in 5 pups- 4 boys and one girl. The boy I kept is now a Champion.

It is an expensive process in time and money with the Groenendael litter costing me about $6,000 when they hit the ground- that included the collection, shipment, stud fee and insemination. It also took several years (4 to be exact) before I found a stud owner willing to have their dog collected as the semen came from a rabies country, there was a battery of blood tests that had to be undergone before the semen could be shipped. There also had to be a protocol in place for the importation which only the Netherlands had with NZ in Europe.

Would I do it again? Yes, but it can be very hard and trying on one's patience!