Over-registration/not Breeding/using Imports

[Avalonia]

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what a load of nonsense. Whats worse a dog with chalk on it or a dog with a bad front or incorrect movement or a hundred other  bad faults. Go around the Bull Terrier ring if anyone is worried about chalk theywill faint when they see the amount of chalk that gets used there.O.k its a kennel club rule that no substance should be used etc etc  but the original poster of this thread surely cannot believe that an inferior dog with a bit of chalk on it will beat a better dog who has no chalk on him. If that were to happen then I would say that the problem is the judge. This is dog showing, these are show dogs. Surely what should concern us more is that for the first time Whippet registrations are in the top twenty, if this breeding trend continues Whippets will go the same way as Afghans did in the 60s. People should be far more concerned about this rather than whether an exhibitor is chalking their dog, furthermore white on white does not change a colour.

  Well said ukusa it is very alarming that we have moved into the top twenty registration wise and it should concern us all that care for the breed. We at Courthill have just had two champion bitches in season and they have not been mated because we are concerned about the amount of whippet puppies that are looking for homes.

        Patsy

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Patsy's message should be a wake up call to everyone who truly cherishes this breed and wishes to see it prosper. When someone with Patsy's track record in the breed is not breeding the very fine English champion dogs she and her partner own over concerns that there are not enough appropriate homes to place those dogs wisely and well in, this is an alarm signal for all of us. The awful truth is we have now reached the point where we can see there are far too many litters being bred -- on both sides of the Atlantic -- very often by people who need to sit back and learn what they are breeding and why before they mate two dogs whose backgrounds they do not really know intimately from experience within the breed, and who expect good returns on those breedings.

We have owned whippets since 1982, but only began to breed in 1991 after we had 7 whippets we had rescued over a period of nearly 9 years. Over those nine years our curiosity led us to learn more about the dogs we rescued, and it was only as part of that process that we even contemplated the possiblity of breeding. During that time we did our best to learn what the breed was about, not daring to breed till we thought we knew enough not to leave the breed worse off than when we entered it. When we finally decided we knew enough to breed reasonably intelligently we chose foundation stock out of Eng.Ch. lines, that was well bred and well linebred and we still had huge difficulties placing the excellent dogs we got in that first litter because we did not have a track record with anyone. In the end, out of our first litter of 8 dogs we ended up keeping 5 of them -- from birth to the day they died -- the last 15 years after it was bred. Folks, those are the harsh facts you have to bear in mind when you decide to be a breeder.

Over the years since then, as we developed a modest track record for producing well-bred dogs of excellent health, disposition and conformation, we have been fortunate enough to be able to place every pup we have bred from the sometimes none, sometimes one, or sometimes two litters usually small litters we have bred each year. But we have never bred with the expectation that there is money to be made by breeding, and we have only bred when we considered there was something we ourselves needed for the future from a particular mating.

I guess we are pretty awful business people, because if we went into whippets to make money we have made a complete balls of it. In each and every one of the years since we first began breeding in the early 1990s we have spent approximately $20,000 Cdn. to own, breed, show, provide good good and veterinary care to the dogs we have bred and own. and in any really good year we have made back less than one quarter of that expenditure from the sale of pupppies. Whippets for us are almost a religion -- they are not a casual -- lets see what we get if we breed this pretty bitch to that top winning dog -- sort of animal and so lets breed it and roll the dice-- and they certainly are never disposable.

Our contract with those who purchase our dogs requires that they return any dog, for any reason, that they cannot keep it, to us, without any questions being asked, for rehoming. We are active in whippet rescue -- in Canada there are puppy mills spewing out ill bred, unhealthy whippets out of bitches bred every six months, season in season out, within 50 miles of us, as well as novice breeders who simply cannot place what they breed and/or they cannot market their dogs and find loving long term homes because they do not know enough about what they bred to have done so intelligently. We have never lost sight of the fact that that whippets prosper best first and foremost family pets, not show dogs and for us, the very best home is the one that adopts a pup with the expectation that the dog will live their full lives in a family situation and given the choice we will and regularly do, place dogs that could win in shows anywhere, in family situations where the dogs will never have a bad day for the whole of their lives because they are so treasured, and so loved.

In 2007 we took in two dogs we did not breed as rescues because both have one dog from our program as grandparents. We know the sad circumstances behind why these dogs needed to be rehomed, and we did so without question because of our belief that if you breed it you should be responsible for it, from birth to death -- and that includes the extended generations too. We feel strongly if you cannot do this then perhaps you should be buying, not breeding, whippets.

I am horrified to hear that whippets are in the Top 20 breeds now in the UK. The other day we got our monthly circular from the American Kennel Club, of which we are members (though we are Canadians) and learned the whippet in America has moved to position 60 on the popularity scale. This may sound like the breed is safe, but when you have a country of 300 million residents and there so many dog owners, there is no room for comfort or feeling safe. A friend in West Virginia called me just as the AKC posting came out to report that the glut of American bred whippet pups on the east coast of the United States is so bad that novice 'breeders' are offering to give away the pups they have bred for FREE because they cannot place them. Anything to get rid of them and cut their financial losses. Whippets are not cash crops. They are family pets, they are beloved companions, they are the soul and spirit within many family units that knit them together, and they are not, not ever, disposable -- free to whoever will take one, for however long.

As I said at the top, if one cannot place what they breed and place them well by having a firm list of homes the bred pups will go to, if you cannot stand behind the dogs you breed, and the dogs bred down from them, if you cannot afford to run on all the dogs you breed, both show dog and pet without regard to ever making a 'profit' (a very ugly word when it comes to living things), on your dogs, then perhaps it is time to think whether you actually want to be a breeder, or just the best darned owner, of one or two or three dogs carefully acquired, that you can be.

A bit of chalk on a few show whippets is not at all comparable to the danger our breed faces if too many dogs are bred for too few good homes. We should all first and foremost be concerned about where the dogs we breed are homed, before we worry about the trivia.

Patsy, it will be good to see you again at Crufts.

Lanny

(mod edit in splitting from original topic to make more clear)

 

[JAX]

what a load of nonsense. Whats worse a dog with chalk on it or a dog with a bad front or incorrect movement or a hundred other  bad faults. Go around the Bull Terrier ring if anyone is worried about chalk theywill faint when they see the amount of chalk that gets used there.O.k its a kennel club rule that no substance should be used etc etc  but the original poster of this thread surely cannot believe that an inferior dog with a bit of chalk on it will beat a better dog who has no chalk on him. If that were to happen then I would say that the problem is the judge. This is dog showing, these are show dogs. Surely what should concern us more is that for the first time Whippet registrations are in the top twenty, if this breeding trend continues Whippets will go the same way as Afghans did in the 60s. People should be far more concerned about this rather than whether an exhibitor is chalking their dog, furthermore white on white does not change a colour.

Well said ukusa it is very alarming that we have moved into the top twenty registration wise and it should concern us all that care for the breed. We at Courthill have just had two champion bitches in season and they have not been mated because we are concerned about the amount of whippet puppies that are looking for homes.

Patsy

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Patsy's message should be a wake up call to everyone who truly cherishes this breed and wishes to see it prosper. When someone with Patsy's track record in the breed is not breeding the very fine English champion dogs she and her partner own over concerns that there are not enough appropriate homes to place those dogs wisely and well in, this is an alarm signal for all of us. The awful truth is we have now reached the point where we can see there are far too many litters being bred -- on both sides of the Atlantic -- very often by people who need to sit back and learn what they are breeding and why before they mate two dogs whose backgrounds they do not really know intimately from experience within the breed, and who expect good returns on those breedings.

We have owned whippets since 1982, but only began to breed in 1991 after we had 7 whippets we had rescued over a period of nearly 9 years. Over those nine years our curiosity led us to learn more about the dogs we rescued, and it was only as part of that process that we even contemplated the possiblity of breeding. During that time we did our best to learn what the breed was about, not daring to breed till we thought we knew enough not to leave the breed worse off than when we entered it. When we finally decided we knew enough to breed reasonably intelligently we chose foundation stock out of Eng.Ch. lines, that was well bred and well linebred and we still had huge difficulties placing the excellent dogs we got in that first litter because we did not have a track record with anyone. In the end, out of our first litter of 8 dogs we ended up keeping 5 of them -- from birth to the day they died -- the last 15 years after it was bred. Folks, those are the harsh facts you have to bear in mind when you decide to be a breeder.

Over the years since then, as we developed a modest track record for producing well-bred dogs of excellent health, disposition and conformation, we have been fortunate enough to be able to place every pup we have bred from the sometimes none, sometimes one, or sometimes two litters usually small litters we have bred each year. But we have never bred with the expectation that there is money to be made by breeding, and we have only bred when we considered there was something we ourselves needed for the future from a particular mating.

I guess we are pretty awful business people, because if we went into whippets to make money we have made a complete balls of it. In each and every one of the years since we first began breeding in the early 1990s we have spent approximately $20,000 Cdn. to own, breed, show, provide good good and veterinary care to the dogs we have bred and own. and in any really good year we have made back less than one quarter of that expenditure from the sale of pupppies. Whippets for us are almost a religion -- they are not a casual -- lets see what we get if we breed this pretty bitch to that top winning dog -- sort of animal and so lets breed it and roll the dice-- and they certainly are never disposable.

Our contract with those who purchase our dogs requires that they return any dog, for any reason, that they cannot keep it, to us, without any questions being asked, for rehoming. We are active in whippet rescue -- in Canada there are puppy mills spewing out ill bred, unhealthy whippets out of bitches bred every six months, season in season out, within 50 miles of us, as well as novice breeders who simply cannot place what they breed and/or they cannot market their dogs and find loving long term homes because they do not know enough about what they bred to have done so intelligently. We have never lost sight of the fact that that whippets prosper best first and foremost family pets, not show dogs and for us, the very best home is the one that adopts a pup with the expectation that the dog will live their full lives in a family situation and given the choice we will and regularly do, place dogs that could win in shows anywhere, in family situations where the dogs will never have a bad day for the whole of their lives because they are so treasured, and so loved.

In 2007 we took in two dogs we did not breed as rescues because both have one dog from our program as grandparents. We know the sad circumstances behind why these dogs needed to be rehomed, and we did so without question because of our belief that if you breed it you should be responsible for it, from birth to death -- and that includes the extended generations too. We feel strongly if you cannot do this then perhaps you should be buying, not breeding, whippets.

I am horrified to hear that whippets are in the Top 20 breeds now in the UK. The other day we got our monthly circular from the American Kennel Club, of which we are members (though we are Canadians) and learned the whippet in America has moved to position 60 on the popularity scale. This may sound like the breed is safe, but when you have a country of 300 million residents and there so many dog owners, there is no room for comfort or feeling safe. A friend in West Virginia called me just as the AKC posting came out to report that the glut of American bred whippet pups on the east coast of the United States is so bad that novice 'breeders' are offering to give away the pups they have bred for FREE because they cannot place them. Anything to get rid of them and cut their financial losses. Whippets are not cash crops. They are family pets, they are beloved companions, they are the soul and spirit within many family units that knit them together, and they are not, not ever, disposable -- free to whoever will take one, for however long.

As I said at the top, if one cannot place what they breed and place them well by having a firm list of homes the bred pups will go to, if you cannot stand behind the dogs you breed, and the dogs bred down from them, if you cannot afford to run on all the dogs you breed, both show dog and pet without regard to ever making a 'profit' (a very ugly word when it comes to living things), on your dogs, then perhaps it is time to think whether you actually want to be a breeder, or just the best darned owner, of one or two or three dogs carefully acquired, that you can be.

A bit of chalk on a few show whippets is not at all comparable to the danger our breed faces if too many dogs are bred for too few good homes. We should all first and foremost be concerned about where the dogs we breed are homed, before we worry about the trivia.

Patsy, it will be good to see you again at Crufts.

Lanny

A friend from the

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All very true of course Lanny , but on K9 you are more than often talking to the converted any how

, Its those folk who dont have any more interest in whippets than just trying to make money out of them , :rant: do you think they sit at a computer and join a whippet forum to learn more about our beloved breed ? No course they dont ,

The Kennel club are quite happy to take all the money from these registrarions , get them to join the Accredited breeders Scheme ( more ££££ s) , they dont care who actually does the breeding as long as the ££ keeps coming in :rant:

As regards not breeding till you know whats in your pedigree , Its going to be lot more difficult now we have had so many imports , Ive got american bloodlines in my dogs pedigrees , but how am I supposed to know what they look like when they are so far away .

OK all are Ch , but I saw some of the CH whippets at the Westminster many years ago , and to be honest , some of them wouldnt have been placed at a local open show

Look foward to meeting you at Crufts ( although I will only be there as a spectator ) Jackie

 

[seaspot_run]

As regards not breeding till you know whats in your pedigree , Its going to be lot more difficult now we have had so many imports  , Ive got american bloodlines in my dogs pedigrees , but how am I supposed to know what they look like when they are so far away . Jackie

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You can always ask us. :teehee: There may even be photographs available! Or video, for that matter.

 

[clayelem]

As regards not breeding till you know whats in your pedigree , Its going to be lot more difficult now we have had so many imports  , Ive got american bloodlines in my dogs pedigrees , but how am I supposed to know what they look like when they are so far away . Jackie

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Hey Jackie I have some American whippet annuals right here if you would like to see if any of your dogs are in there.

Phyllis

 

[Angela Bayley]

All very true of course Lanny , but on K9 you are more than often talking to the converted any how
, Its those folk who dont have any more interest in whippets than just trying to make money out of them , :rant:   do you think they sit at a computer and join a whippet forum to learn more about our beloved breed ? No course they dont , 

The Kennel club are quite happy to take all the money from these registrarions , get them to join the Accredited breeders Scheme ( more ££££ s) , they dont care who actually does the breeding as long as the ££ keeps coming in  :rant:

As regards not breeding till you know whats in your pedigree , Its going to be lot more difficult now we have had so many imports  , Ive got american bloodlines in my dogs pedigrees , but how am I supposed to know what they look like when they are so far away .

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I wonder if you saw the featured letter from Jo Amsel in this week's DW on just this subject (ABS)? It seems to echo exactly the points you make.

And in the same issue two distressing reports of puppy farmers....

 

[UKUSA]

Well said Patsy and Lanny, at last we are moving away from this ridiculous chalk issue and getting to more important issues. The fact is that there are more Whippet litters being bred now than ever before, that the breed in this country is now in the top twenty should make us all think about what we are doing. We only have to look around us at once popular and numericle strong breeds, like Min Poodles, whose entries at shows used to be large now they are lucky if they can drum up 30, to see what indescriminate and over breeding has done. You would have to search long and hard to find a line clear of health problems.

Our kennel club will register a litter for anyone who will pay for it and as far as the ABS is concerned well what validity can that have when puppy farmers boast that they are part of it. I would say that as concerned breeders we in this country should endorse every puppy we breed, that option is open to us and providing your puppy buyer is made very aware of what this means and you have it in writing and it is witnessed the K.C will back you.

I dont know if I agree about preaching to the converted, there seem to be a lot of litters bred by people who use this forum, well thats up to them but if we dont deal with this now later might be too late!

As far as American Champions are concerned, first of all the American standard differs to our own and secondly as strong in numbers as we are strong in quality we are not! So let us not insult our American friends.

 

[Angela Bayley]

because of our belief that if you breed it you should be responsible for it, from birth to death -- and that includes the extended generations too.  We feel strongly if you cannot do this then perhaps you should be buying, not breeding, whippets.
Whippets are not cash crops.  They are family pets, they are beloved companions, they are the soul and spirit within many family units that knit them together, and they are not, not ever, disposable -- free to whoever will take one, for however long.

As I said at the top, if one cannot place what they breed and place them well by having a firm list of homes the bred pups will go to, if you cannot stand behind the dogs you breed, and the dogs bred down from them, if you cannot afford to run on all the dogs you breed, both show dog and pet without regard to ever making a 'profit' (a very ugly word when it comes to living things), on your dogs, then perhaps it is time to think whether you actually want to be a breeder, or just the best darned owner, of one or two or three dogs carefully acquired, that you can be.

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If only (if only!) the KC would enforce this as a condition of registration.

If you choose to breed you should be prepared to keep ALL of your puppies.

This should be enough to make the 'established' breeders choke on their G&T...

 

[JAX]

My aim was NOT to insult our American friends at all ,. I knew someone would jump on that comment but just to point out that as we cant see them ( ok we can see pictures , many thanks for the offers , :cheers: ) but whippets or any breed of dog is not judged on how lovely and correct to the standard they look standing , but also about MOVEMENT .

yes and thanks for offers of videos too :huggles: , but the usa video are not compatable to UK ones , well not the ones Ive bought in the past , anyhow

 

[UKUSA]

because of our belief that if you breed it you should be responsible for it, from birth to death -- and that includes the extended generations too.  We feel strongly if you cannot do this then perhaps you should be buying, not breeding, whippets.
Whippets are not cash crops.  They are family pets, they are beloved companions, they are the soul and spirit within many family units that knit them together, and they are not, not ever, disposable -- free to whoever will take one, for however long.

As I said at the top, if one cannot place what they breed and place them well by having a firm list of homes the bred pups will go to, if you cannot stand behind the dogs you breed, and the dogs bred down from them, if you cannot afford to run on all the dogs you breed, both show dog and pet without regard to ever making a 'profit' (a very ugly word when it comes to living things), on your dogs, then perhaps it is time to think whether you actually want to be a breeder, or just the best darned owner, of one or two or three dogs carefully acquired, that you can be.

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If only (if only!) the KC would enforce this as a condition of registration.

If you choose to breed you should be prepared to keep ALL of your puppies.

This should be enough to make the 'established' breeders choke on their G&T...

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What do you mean by established breeders? If you mean people who have been in the breed a long time, I think that you will find that goes without saying. That is not the problem, we have all of us at some time or another had puppies who have stayed awhile untill the right home comes along, that is all part of it. I do notthink that has any thing to do with the over breeding that seems to be going on at the moment

 

[kirsty633]

some of them wouldnt have been placed at a local open show shocked.gif

Not necessarily ONLY in the US :- " :- " :- "

 

[Scudder]

My aim was NOT to insult our American friends at all ,. I knew someone would jump on that comment    but just to point out that as we cant see them ( ok we can see pictures , many thanks for the offers , :cheers: ) but whippets or any breed of dog is not judged on how lovely and correct to the standard they look standing , but also about MOVEMENT .
yes and thanks for offers of videos too :huggles:   , but the usa video are not compatable to UK ones , well not the ones Ive bought in the past , anyhow 

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With modern sites like YouTube, etc that video gap gets bridged pretty easily. We're at the mercy of our UK counterparts for pedigree critiques on the imported dogs that are here in the US as well.

Having both Australian and UK bloodlines sitting on my couch, I would hope that I could email the breeders and get honest opinions on the various dogs in their pedigrees...their weaknesses and strengths... and build on those opinions when making breeding choices into US lines. :thumbsup:

Kristen

 

[JAX]

My aim was NOT to insult our American friends at all ,. I knew someone would jump on that comment    but just to point out that as we cant see them ( ok we can see pictures , many thanks for the offers , :cheers: ) but whippets or any breed of dog is not judged on how lovely and correct to the standard they look standing , but also about MOVEMENT .
yes and thanks for offers of videos too :huggles:   , but the usa video are not compatable to UK ones , well not the ones Ive bought in the past , anyhow 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

With modern sites like YouTube, etc that video gap gets bridged pretty easily. We're at the mercy of our UK counterparts for pedigree critiques on the imported dogs that are here in the US as well.

Having both Australian and UK bloodlines sitting on my couch, I would hope that I could email the breeders and get honest opinions on the various dogs in their pedigrees...their weaknesses and strengths... and build on those opinions when making breeding choices into US lines. :thumbsup:

Kristen

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Hey > I never thought of that :cheers: Thanks Kristen , Mind you my step daughter says my computer is c**p so maybe I wouldnt be able to get them any how , next time shes here Ill ask her where / how to find them )

 

[Seraphina]

My aim was NOT to insult our American friends at all ,. I knew someone would jump on that comment    but just to point out that as we cant see them ( ok we can see pictures , many thanks for the offers , :cheers: ) but whippets or any breed of dog is not judged on how lovely and correct to the standard they look standing , but also about MOVEMENT .
yes and thanks for offers of videos too :huggles:   , but the usa video are not compatable to UK ones , well not the ones Ive bought in the past , anyhow 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

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I would not trust pictures. It is quite possible to make bad dog to look good and also good dog to look bad. Of-course they are better than nothing. To really have a good knowledge of an overseas dog I would like to get a video of his siblings, his parents and their siblings, and his grandparents. They will each need to be set up, then standing naturally without any intervention, and moving, and i would like their weight, height. And some photos of dogs in the generations further back would not go astray.

As far as asking people for opinions about dogs goes, it is also difficult. To start with sometimes I dislike a dog my friends think is very nice, and vice versa. So much is a personal opinion

 

[seaspot_run]

My aim was NOT to insult our American friends at all ,. I knew someone would jump on that comment    but just to point out that as we cant see them ( ok we can see pictures , many thanks for the offers , :cheers: ) but whippets or any breed of dog is not judged on how lovely and correct to the standard they look standing , but also about MOVEMENT .
yes and thanks for offers of videos too :huggles:   , but the usa video are not compatable to UK ones , well not the ones Ive bought in the past , anyhow 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

​

With modern sites like YouTube, etc that video gap gets bridged pretty easily. We're at the mercy of our UK counterparts for pedigree critiques on the imported dogs that are here in the US as well.

Having both Australian and UK bloodlines sitting on my couch, I would hope that I could email the breeders and get honest opinions on the various dogs in their pedigrees...their weaknesses and strengths... and build on those opinions when making breeding choices into US lines. :thumbsup:

Kristen

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Hey > I never thought of that :cheers: Thanks Kristen , Mind you my step daughter says my computer is c**p so maybe I wouldnt be able to get them any how , next time shes here Ill ask her where / how to find them )

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If you want to know the virtues of the American dogs in your pedigrees, ask their owners. :thumbsup: If you want to know their faults, ask their competition! :teehee:

Seriously, I've hunted up as many photos as I can of the dogs in English Mabel's pedigree and the Aussie and UK imports behind the Byerley dog I bred to, and I know I can rely on Cathie to critique the dogs she owned/bred, or saw in the flesh and used, but I don't think this situation is all that different from coming into a breed and relying on breeders who came before you or who have traveled extensively to share with you their knowledge of the dogs in your pedigrees, since many of those dogs may have died already or are so old that you can no longer evaluate their movement fairly.

We all depend in this hobby on honesty and helpful advice of those who have seen dogs we've not seen. I've used several dogs without even seeing them in the flesh, but I can rely on their owners/breeders to give me the honest assessment.

You would be surprised how small our world has become thanks to the internet.

For example, two American dogs who are in pedigrees in the UK now that I could personally help with are Sporting Fields Jazz Fest and Paris Panther.

Yes, I did not breed "Rory", but my mother was the agent for Topaz kennel and not only showed and finished Rory's sire, but also we owned a bitch from that litter, and I saw the entire litter Topaz Jazz Singer came from. My mother also handled Jazz Singer's dam, her sire, her dam, and we owned and bred the sire of Jazz Singer, a dog called Surrey Hill Rogue of Chelsea. Rogue of Chelsea's dam was ours, as was her sire, and the dam of the dam was owned by close friends of mine I lived five minutes away from and know that whole pedigree as well. The sire of Rogue of Chelsea is a dog I gave Best in Sweepstakes to in my first US Whippet assignment, and I co-owned a litterbrother of HIS dam with my ex-boyfriend, and the dam of those dogs ended up living with me for almost a year when my housemate leased her to breed to HIS stud dog.

And if I didn't know, I could tell you who to ask!

So, you see, it's a very small world now. 8)

Apologies to the original poster for changing the subject, but sometimes threads take on a life of their own.

 

[seaspot_run]

With regard to the post about breeders giving away puppies in the Eastern US, I would just like to respectfully disagree that such is a widespread problem. Although I think pet inquiries dropped off in the aftermath of all the news coverage of Vivi the Missing Westminster KC Whippet, it seems to be on the upswing again. I have never had to sit long on pet puppies I wanted to sell and this has been the case for most of us over the last decade.

I do not know who Avonlea was talking to and so it may be that breeder is in a really bad area for selling pets, but for the most part, if you don't breed another litter until you've placed everything from the last litter you bred that you wanted to place, then you don't end up with lots of unsold puppies. The breeders who I am aware of who are having some sort of problem are overbreeding for the market in their area. You have to know what you can sell, and not breed more than that area can carry.

For me, this is 1.5 litters a year, since my girls tend to be very generous with the quantity of puppies that they give me. No doubt, if I bred five litters a year, I'd be sitting on unsold puppies quite a lot. I find averaging 1.5 litters allows me to maintain a viable breeding program, always have something in competition that is working on titles, and not oversaturate my pet market.

There's a market, but you have to breed within that market. It's just simple supply and demand theory.

Three litters a year may be too much in some parts of the US, and too few (to fill local demand) in other parts. There's no hard and fast number and the better your referral network, the more likely good homes will find you.

I'm sure that's true in the UK, too.

Karen Lee

 

[patsy]

Very true Karen, one litter a year as a serious breeder will keep your lines going smoothly, if every one had this attitude it would be much better for the breed.

As for the American whippets I think you can be very proud, your very best must rate the best in the world and could certainly win top honours worldwide. Not to mention their names but have seen many that would take your breath away, and would loved to have campaigned in England. Records speak realms look at a lot of our top winners over the last three years and I say it from the heart THANK YOU AMERICA, AND PERSONALLY I HAVE TO SAY A BIG THANK YOU TO SPORTING FIELD .Yes I have been one of the lucky ones to have judged in your country twice and Canada once, like us they are not all first class but when the Americans get it right they are stunning.

 

[Seraphina]

With regard to the post about breeders giving away puppies in the Eastern US, I would just like to respectfully disagree that such is a widespread problem.  Although I think pet inquiries dropped off in the aftermath of all the news coverage of Vivi the Missing Westminster KC Whippet, it seems to be on the upswing again.  I have never had to sit long on pet puppies I wanted to sell and this has been the case for most of us over the last decade. 
Karen Lee

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I wonder why would the Vivi story caused a drop of sales? I would have thought it would if anything attract people's attention to the breed. :unsure:

If some breeders cannot sell their pups while others do it is quite possible that there is something that potential buyers do not like about them.

 

[seaspot_run]

With regard to the post about breeders giving away puppies in the Eastern US, I would just like to respectfully disagree that such is a widespread problem.  Although I think pet inquiries dropped off in the aftermath of all the news coverage of Vivi the Missing Westminster KC Whippet, it seems to be on the upswing again.  I have never had to sit long on pet puppies I wanted to sell and this has been the case for most of us over the last decade. 
Karen Lee

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I wonder why would the Vivi story caused a drop of sales? I would have thought it would if anything attract people's attention to the breed. :unsure:

If some breeders cannot sell their pups while others do it is quite possible that there is something that potential buyers do not like about them.

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That's just my personal theory and I have NOTHING to back it up, other than a sense that inquiries tanked for the year or so after that story got so much play. I certainly would have done the same thing (go to the media and publicize her disappearance) if she were mine, but the public is a fickle creature and I think that in a lot of people's minds who might have been considering the Whippet, the breed got "branded" as the breed that runs away and can't be caught. If you were google searching Whippet, you likely got the story of Vivi the escaped Whippet. That's just the reality of the modern era of being in dogs. News stories outlive their cycle on the 'net.

Karen Lee

 

[chelynnah]

Have split this from the chalking topic - keep it friendly and non-personal please and thanks. No 'handbags at dawn' and all that :cheers:

Wendy

 

[Seraphina]

I would find it rather puzzling if people could not sell their pups yet kept breeding? Surely if somebody is knee deep in puppies that nobody wants, why would they think of mating another bitch? Unless they are totally obsessed with breeding a new show winning stock for themselves, and do not care about anything else. :wacko: :unsure: