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Well worth a read...vets views http://www.vets4docking.org.uk/statement.htm
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Dog Tail Docking Statement from Dogs Trust
- Thread starter Macha
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Quoted from the above source:littleminx said:
"Docking is arguably also necessary as a cosmetic requirement in certain breeds so that they can continue to flourish and supply the traditional pet market with the most desirable stock. Experience has shown that pet owners, even when aware of tail docking will not readily purchase undocked varieties of traditionally docked breeds."
First of all, the last sentence is simply not true! Fluctuations in the popularity of traditionally docked breeds have been so small, that they cannot be attributed to the ban in countries where this has already been passed.
Also, to me the phrasing is really revealing of the attitude of these vets: "Pets" are first and foremost commodities to be bought and sold - and as such, the vets want their share of the profits. It is probably 10 times as profitable to dock a hundred pups than to try and fix the tail of the one that is worked and suffers injury to its tail.
Taken from a RSPCA Forum:-ja jumper said:
"The RSPCA is swimming in money ( £119 million in 1996) and appears to be adrift in a sea of under achievement. After 174 years of the Society’s existence, last year there was a reported increase of 17% in cruelty to animals. Having had orders from the Charity Commission to reduce the Society’s reserves to £45 million, the RSPCA sent out a letter asking every member to give £15 to for 16 new Inspectors. The cost of this was estimated at £688,000 for the first year. PEANUTS compared to the £2 million being given to Freedom Food for advertising. WHAT IS HAPPENING TO ALL THE MILLIONS THE RSPCA HAS BEEN ORDERED TO SPEND if £688,000 cannot be afforded for extra Inspectors
All of this should tell even the most stupid person that the RSPCA is sending out
THE WRONG MESSAGE"
Seems like the RSPCA has lost its way getting involved in Freedom Food and hunting etc it seems to have turned its back on caring for strays and abuse cases
masta once again people cant give their view without others being very rude back to them, :rant: im not stupied im just giving my view,
i'm sorry if you thought i was rude, i never actually said anything the passage was cut and pasted from the RSPCA watchdog forum and was a post from an RSPCA member can you explain why you felt i was rude
Well as someone who owns two running dogs with dewclaws - a deerhound and a whippet x - and those dogs free run everyday in fields and woodland and they have never had a serious problem with them.
I've also owned an undocked Giant Schnauzer who never had a problem with his tail. I did get a comment once about how his tail hurt when he wagged it and that was why it was a good idea to dock them. What a total load of rubbish that was. And guess what the person saying it was a Spinone show person.
I've had one split tail with my dogs once. That was on a collie x didn't hear anyone jumping up and down going on about how awful it was that collie x's weren't docked.
To be honest there is a huge amount of drivel written about tail docking. Most of the breeds that are docked don't need it doing. It's obsolete in this day and age for most breeds of dog. It's done because it changes the look of the dog and it's tradition. Just like it still is to crop the ears of dogs in certain countries. BTW macho idiots in this country have been known to still do it 'cause it makes their dogs look hard.
Racing greyhounds are bad for splitting their tails and no one is jumping up and down wanting them docked at birth. I wonder why.
Dobes and other such guard dogs had their tails docked to stop people from grabbing them. Yeah like I'm about to grab the tail of an angry Rottie. I don't think so.
As for sheep they dock 'em because of fly strike 'cause farmers don't go around wiping their sheep bums if they scour. However if one of my dogs had poo on it's fur then I'd clean it up fast. Well my dogs live in my house.
Sorry but I've read so much twaddle about the reasons to dock dogs and the only ones that stand up to any scrutiny are.
1) Because we like the way that the dogs look with docked tails.
2) and because working spaniels have problems if they aren't docked.
I've also owned an undocked Giant Schnauzer who never had a problem with his tail. I did get a comment once about how his tail hurt when he wagged it and that was why it was a good idea to dock them. What a total load of rubbish that was. And guess what the person saying it was a Spinone show person.
I've had one split tail with my dogs once. That was on a collie x didn't hear anyone jumping up and down going on about how awful it was that collie x's weren't docked.
To be honest there is a huge amount of drivel written about tail docking. Most of the breeds that are docked don't need it doing. It's obsolete in this day and age for most breeds of dog. It's done because it changes the look of the dog and it's tradition. Just like it still is to crop the ears of dogs in certain countries. BTW macho idiots in this country have been known to still do it 'cause it makes their dogs look hard.
Racing greyhounds are bad for splitting their tails and no one is jumping up and down wanting them docked at birth. I wonder why.
Dobes and other such guard dogs had their tails docked to stop people from grabbing them. Yeah like I'm about to grab the tail of an angry Rottie. I don't think so.
As for sheep they dock 'em because of fly strike 'cause farmers don't go around wiping their sheep bums if they scour. However if one of my dogs had poo on it's fur then I'd clean it up fast. Well my dogs live in my house.
Sorry but I've read so much twaddle about the reasons to dock dogs and the only ones that stand up to any scrutiny are.
1) Because we like the way that the dogs look with docked tails.
2) and because working spaniels have problems if they aren't docked.
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Yes it is definitely a quick buck for a vet.bardmand said:
Actually, i used to meet in our park number of people with their pet dogs with tails (cockers, rotties, dobes, poodles) and when i asked how come, they said they put in an order for the tail to be left on.
The same argument about injuries was also used about ears to justify cropping. And really if a dog is running through thick undergrowth it is more likely to injure an ear than a tail.
If dogs get such a terrible injuries by wagging their tails, why do not we see any in Whippets? And great danes are well known to give you a bruise if you stand too close, not to mention their ability to clear the coffee table.
I lived for ten years on wild overgrown property, with brambles and other thorny bushes, my dogs went charging through the undergrowth and came home with scrathes on their noses and front leggs but never a tail.
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Some years ago i saw a TV debate pro and against docking. The pro docking group just could not put a one single really good argument. There was this old lady, breeder of Yorkies (i think?) and she was getting more and more upset, in the end she jumped up picked up the little terrier she had with her put him on a table and almost crying shouted; "But you cannot leave tails on them, you just can't, just look at him HE WOULDN'T KNOW WHERE TO PUT IT!!!!" Everybody, of-course, laughed and i felt rather sorry for her.
I think it's quite funny how much energy is waisted debating something so trivial.
I think it's quite funny how much energy is waisted debating something so trivial.
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oh touche! :thumbsup:Tony Taylor said:Hmmm 382 posts v 1977 posts :- "kris said:
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The letter from dogs trust was about making sure all tail docking was illegal not just tail docking for fashion. Whether tail docking becuse it's fashionable in a certain breed is a good idea is questionable but I can't see making it illegal being such a good idea either; Would you really want to see someone in jail for tail docking?
As far as certain working breeds goes all the evidence would suggest that it's in the dogs best interest to have the tail docked. Interestingly from what I know of both spaniels and terriers the idea is to dock only the last 1/3 of a tail which is a little different from the short stumps left on pedigree show dogs.
Greyhounds don't have their tails docked because the tail is thought to act as a counter balance in running at speed and anectodatal evidence suggests that those dogs that lose a bigger part of their tail fail to perform as well. No doubt some of the animal rights charities will now be calling for all ghds to be docked :unsure: . Plenty off non ped whippets certainly aren't using their tails as counter balances since they have them curled up over their backs although some my own curlys have the turning circle of an oil tanker and stopping distance of the same.
As far as the RSPCA and other animal rights organisations goes there is a pressing need to generate income and since hunting will no longer provide them with good advertising copy they're compelled to bullshit over something else. To claim that the RSPCA are compelled to distroy animals because they cannot afford to shelter them whilst simultaneously promoting themselves as an organisation caring for distressed animals while sitting on enormous cash reserves, paying exhorbitant amounts of money to failed politcos with zero knowledge of animal husbandry to act as CEOs in the plushest London HQs and making large political donations to dubious non charitable causes, is frankly obscene. Their charitable status should be revoked.
As far as certain working breeds goes all the evidence would suggest that it's in the dogs best interest to have the tail docked. Interestingly from what I know of both spaniels and terriers the idea is to dock only the last 1/3 of a tail which is a little different from the short stumps left on pedigree show dogs.
Greyhounds don't have their tails docked because the tail is thought to act as a counter balance in running at speed and anectodatal evidence suggests that those dogs that lose a bigger part of their tail fail to perform as well. No doubt some of the animal rights charities will now be calling for all ghds to be docked :unsure: . Plenty off non ped whippets certainly aren't using their tails as counter balances since they have them curled up over their backs although some my own curlys have the turning circle of an oil tanker and stopping distance of the same.
As far as the RSPCA and other animal rights organisations goes there is a pressing need to generate income and since hunting will no longer provide them with good advertising copy they're compelled to bullshit over something else. To claim that the RSPCA are compelled to distroy animals because they cannot afford to shelter them whilst simultaneously promoting themselves as an organisation caring for distressed animals while sitting on enormous cash reserves, paying exhorbitant amounts of money to failed politcos with zero knowledge of animal husbandry to act as CEOs in the plushest London HQs and making large political donations to dubious non charitable causes, is frankly obscene. Their charitable status should be revoked.
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