Hunting With Dogs - For Or Against?

[midlanderkeith]

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I hope you don't take offence at me asking this, Lin, but have you ever witnessed a foxhound killing a fox? For real, that is, not on a media video.
Foxhounds are very large animals and the fox is dispatched swiftly with one bite to the back of the neck by the lead hound. In the same way as a whippet will kill a rabbit.

Rabbits scream as they are caught and will also struggle until they are dead.

The other hounds are never far behind, and if the huntsman is not right with them, the pack will eat the fox then and there.  But that fox is already dead.

The other thing you have said which I find bemusing is that you think the mounted followers are "hunting down" the fox. 

The foxhounds hunt the fox, with the Huntsman in charge of the pack to direct them with his voice and with the hunting horn.  All the hounds are trained to respond to different tones and sounds of the hunting horn so that control can be kept from a distance.  There are also two or three "whips", who ride shotgun, so to speak, to the pack in order to keep them on the correct line and to avoid them running onto land where they are not allowed to go.

The followers, whether mounted or on foot, are led by the Field Master whose job it is to ensure that the followers do not cross the line of the hounds or foul the job in hand.  The main reason that people go fox hunting is to have a chance to ride their horses over farmland which is otherwise private and out of bounds to horse riders.  Both the horses and their owners enjoy this and, quite frankly, it has nothing to do with killing a fox!!!

Of course there will be some people who hunt and wish to watch hounds work and see the skill of the huntsman in directing his pack to an effective conclusion but IMHO they are the minority.

There are always two sides to every situation in life and if you think a fox doesn't stand a chance then you need to watch a real hunt (although now it's banned you can't :- " )!  I have hunted on and off for the last 30 years and I have not seen a fox killed yet.  But I have seen alot of foxes sitting on top of hedges watching the hounds go past and jumping up into hay barns where they can't be found!!! And they sit there and laugh!!!  Believe me, a strong healthy fox is more than a match for a pack of hounds  :thumbsup:

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crafty little beggars . eh

 

[Linbin]

I hope you don't take offence at me asking this, Lin, but have you ever witnessed a foxhound killing a fox? For real, that is, not on a media video.
Foxhounds are very large animals and the fox is dispatched swiftly with one bite to the back of the neck by the lead hound. In the same way as a whippet will kill a rabbit.

Rabbits scream as they are caught and will also struggle until they are dead.

The other hounds are never far behind, and if the huntsman is not right with them, the pack will eat the fox then and there.  But that fox is already dead.

The other thing you have said which I find bemusing is that you think the mounted followers are "hunting down" the fox. 

The foxhounds hunt the fox, with the Huntsman in charge of the pack to direct them with his voice and with the hunting horn.  All the hounds are trained to respond to different tones and sounds of the hunting horn so that control can be kept from a distance.  There are also two or three "whips", who ride shotgun, so to speak, to the pack in order to keep them on the correct line and to avoid them running onto land where they are not allowed to go.

The followers, whether mounted or on foot, are led by the Field Master whose job it is to ensure that the followers do not cross the line of the hounds or foul the job in hand.  The main reason that people go fox hunting is to have a chance to ride their horses over farmland which is otherwise private and out of bounds to horse riders.  Both the horses and their owners enjoy this and, quite frankly, it has nothing to do with killing a fox!!!

Of course there will be some people who hunt and wish to watch hounds work and see the skill of the huntsman in directing his pack to an effective conclusion but IMHO they are the minority.

There are always two sides to every situation in life and if you think a fox doesn't stand a chance then you need to watch a real hunt (although now it's banned you can't :- " )!  I have hunted on and off for the last 30 years and I have not seen a fox killed yet.  But I have seen alot of foxes sitting on top of hedges watching the hounds go past and jumping up into hay barns where they can't be found!!! And they sit there and laugh!!!  Believe me, a strong healthy fox is more than a match for a pack of hounds  :thumbsup:

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I must admit Jane that I am quite ignorant of the facts about hunting and no, I have never seen a foxhunt and dont really know how it is done. All I have seen are media reports and these lead you to believe that the fox is dug out of his burrow, chased for miles on horseback until the dogs tear it limb from limb. I am quite a squeamish person and hate to think of any animal suffering.

Also I had the impression there is never any escape for the fox, I thought they were automatically all killed and have even read about them being bred so that people can hunt more (that is before the ban).

I still wouldn't say I am in favour of hunting but what you have told me has put it into more perspective and I am glad that it is not as horrific I thought it was.

 

[Bellefire]

The followers, whether mounted or on foot, are led by the Field Master whose job it is to ensure that the followers do not cross the line of the hounds or foul the job in hand.  The main reason that people go fox hunting is to have a chance to ride their horses over farmland which is otherwise private and out of bounds to horse riders.  Both the horses and their owners enjoy this and, quite frankly, it has nothing to do with killing a fox!!!

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very true. i have only been out with my mare once with the hunt, and it was for that reason. She loves jumping cross country, and going out with the local hunt gave me a chance to try her over some different jumps, as well as being able to go in a group with my friends.

 

[Janimal]

I will admit Ive only been hunting on horseback once on a New Years Day and loved every minute, .... and also that day no fox killed.

Saw quite a few on that day....a long time ago now..(.but I will bet it hasnt changed that much...) and all of the ones seen escaped...

I also have friends in the dale that do the hunting on foot with hounds too.

They dont die the brutal death that everyone imagines, and in most cases the hounds are not allowed to rip it to shreds....thats what the 'whipperins' are for :thumbsup:

I work on a 750 acre farm and the amount of poulty/ even cats that has been killed over the years...purely killed and not eaten. The farmers allowed the hunt over their land but that has all stopped now since the ban. So they just get men with guns to do the job or give permission to people to work it.

I just believe in management too of the countryside and without it...we would then be overun by these type of animals.

I still call myself an animal lover and always will, and Im certainly far from beinf a Toff either...

 

[nigelmcfc]

Some good replies there , from people who have actually been out with a hunt and witnessed it for themselves instead of just relying on the anti propaganda . In all the times I`ve been out with a hunt (mostly footpack) I`ve never witnessed anything that I could categorically state was cruel or unsporting

The problem with this country is that there are too many people who think they know it all and rely on the media to top up their knowledge - the media are often keen to sensationalise hunting , so Joe Public believes what he sees on the news or in the Sun . It was the same with hare coursing . If you haven`t witnessed it yourself , then you really can`t criticise , but there are a lot of armchair computer hunter experts on here :cheers:

 

[helsbels16]

Im totally FOR hunting. I wouldn't have a lurcher if i wasnt!!!! That is what he lives for, (other than to be with me!)

I bet all those people who are anti hunt are quite willing to eat the meat that is hunted!!!

 

[rachaelx-x]

I'm pro hunting but not a member of a club.

I personally belive all dogs have a purpose and where possible in life they should be able to do so as they love to do it.

A couple of years ago a witnessed someone coursing rabbits with whippets as I was still at school and never seen anything like this, so asked could I come into the field and watch,(im not a sicko) and was fasinated by the agility of both the preditor(whippet) and prey(rabbit) a fair few of the rabbits were killed but some got away for another day.

This is what sparked me off one vistit to see somthing for real. none of my parents hunt, brothers sisters or family,but I do now.

Rabbits are not a native pest and really need to be controlled, also the dogooders that release mink from fur farms is this rite?

some i know visited a local farm every nite for a week, 2 foxes a nite every nite he was there thats 14 foxes in 7 nights, post ban thats not good. They need controlling.

my girlfriend who's user name im on, was well against hunting, her parents didn't see what it was all about, her mum rehomed a lurcher from dogs home, cracking bitch dosn't work but still catches them greys, its in their blood.

since we got our whippet who is a loved pet and treated like a child, he was bought to work and is doing, and now the mrs wants to go ferreting, lamping ect... its totally changed her attitude, she may not dispatch them but still enjoys seeing Tod have ago.

when people listen and learn the facts that you not tourchering Thumper but a quick clean dispatch attitudes can change.

people will learn and the Ban will be repealed and myself and children will see a waterloo cup, for the first time.

any Animal hunted with dogs has a clean dispatch, whether rat, rabbit, Hare, fox or deer as these different breeds are bred for the particular prey and dispatch it as quick as possible so they dont injured themselves. fit animals will escape.

nature intends us to hunt survial of the fittest.

Hunt or be Hunted

Eat or be eaten.

 

[milliken]

mate that is one of the trueist posts and best wrote ive seen in a while

robert

 

[posh totty]

I'm pro hunting but not a member of a club.
I personally belive all dogs have a purpose and where possible in life they should be able to do so as they love to do it.

A couple of years ago a witnessed someone coursing rabbits with whippets as I was still at school and never seen anything like this, so asked could I come into the field and watch,(im not a sicko) and was fasinated by the agility of both the preditor(whippet) and prey(rabbit) a fair few of the rabbits were killed  but some got away for another day.

This is what sparked me off one vistit to see somthing for real. none of my parents hunt, brothers sisters or family,but I do now.

Rabbits are not a native pest and really need to be controlled, also the dogooders that release mink from fur farms is this rite?

some i know visited a local farm every nite for a week, 2 foxes a nite every nite he was there thats 14 foxes in 7 nights, post ban thats not good. They need controlling.

my girlfriend who's user name im on, was well against hunting, her parents didn't see what it was all about, her mum rehomed a lurcher from dogs home, cracking bitch dosn't work but still catches them greys, its in their blood.

since we got our whippet who is a loved pet and treated like a child, he was bought to work and is doing, and now the mrs wants to go ferreting, lamping ect... its totally changed her attitude, she may not dispatch them but still enjoys seeing Tod have ago.

when people listen and learn the facts that you not tourchering Thumper but a quick clean dispatch attitudes can change.

people will learn and the Ban will be repealed and myself and children will see a waterloo cup, for the first time.

any Animal hunted with dogs has a clean dispatch, whether rat, rabbit, Hare, fox or deer as these different breeds are bred for the particular prey and dispatch it as quick as possible so they dont injured themselves. fit animals will escape.

nature intends us to hunt survial of the fittest.

Hunt or be Hunted

Eat or be eaten.

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fantastic post!!!! here here :thumbsup:

 

[Hula]

I have 3 whippets and a lurcher . they are all healthy happy pets . I am totally against any form of hunting whether it be fox or rabbit or anything else .

I often wonder what sort of pleasure people get from killing beautiful wildlife . I do not consider them to be pests they are our native British wildlife and we should be proud of them . I don't really expect anyone to agree with me for fear of being ridiculed but like everyone else here I am entitled to my opinion

 

[rachaelx-x]

I often wonder what sort of pleasure people get from killing beautiful wildlife .

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Its not the pleasure of the killing animals as 90% of hare ect get away un-harmed its seeing a running dog run as naturally as possible and being tested to its limit it keep sight hounds up to scratch, and keeps the aware and healthy, make there brain consentrate not like chasing a Tenis ball, its natural instinct for it to happen and a way of life for people and for some how the make money to feed there familys.

I do not consider them to be pests they are our native British wildlife and we should be proud of them .

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Rabbits are not Native British wildlife and need controlling they cause millions of pounds wrth of damage every year, but some people turn a blind eye to that and get involved before learing the facts.

free range poultry is the future, as are lambs but foxes kill plenty to survive so many that they cant eat them all, more cost for British farmers when it can be controlled.

mink arn't natural British whildlife but we see plenty about killing natural fish, birds and mamals that are native, this is because do gooders let them go because it not fair to kill them for fur, they breed like mad they have no naural preditors and now need wiping out before they desimate animals that should be her such as the water vole and birds.

for something to live somthing else has to die its natures way and all we are doing is what God intended.

have you ever seen dog at work, it the most amaizing site in the world and one that should be appriciated.

 

[meddling]

Bluebell got her first close up sight of a rabbit last night, they popped up within a couple of metres from her...up to this point (she's 15months) she hadn't ever appeared to have noticed them....

well this time she did notice them...she couldnt ignore them...

she stood and watched them lollop off...she then pottered off again...not a hint of wanting to chase them....

we then watched a couple of young deer eating and mooching...she didn't fancy chasing them either...

I think I may have gone wrong somewhere.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Hula]

Mink , rabbits and gray squirrels may not originally have been British wildlife but they did not ask to come here and they have been here so long they are natural now . People brought these animals here and now we just have to deal with it .

I do live in a country area I see rabbits , deer , foxes and the occasional badger every day of my life .

I have seen dogs " working " and it was a horrible sight with the poor animals who were being hunted running for their life .

I know everyone will not agree with me but I am entitled to my point of view as others are entitled to theirs .

 

[Mark Roberts]

Hula,

you like every one else is entitled to their view but as this is a working/lure coursing section please dont be suprised if the majority dont agree with you.

to everyone else please remember everyones views are valid pro/anti keep replies within the board rules.

 

[Hula]

A lot has been said on this forum about  coursing and hunting with dogs , I`m interested to find out just how deep the anti sentiment is out there amongst whippet owners

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I only repled to this topic because it seemed that the topic starter wanted to know the " anti " point of view ?

 

[rachaelx-x]

EVERYONE IS ENTITLED TO THERE OPINION BUT LITTLE BUNNYS RUNNING FOR THERE LIVES IS NATURAL. THATS WHY THEY HAVE BEEN GIVEN DEFENCES SUCH AS GOOD BACK LEGS FOR RUNNING BIG EYES FOR SITE, LONG EARS FOR HEARING THIS IS ALL ADVANTAGES OVER THE DOGS. THEY CAN ALSO TURN ON A 6PENCE AND KNOW THE LANDSCAPE AND HIDE AWAYS BETTER THAN ANY WORKING DOG.

THE DOG IS THE UNDER DOG WHICH IS WHY IT CONTROLS THE SPECIASE AND MAKES THEM BETTER ANIMLAS WEED OUT THE SICK AND ELDERLY AND THE STUPID ANIMALS.

IF THEY WASNT SUCH CUTE ANIMALS PEOPLE WOULD FEEL DIFFERENT HOW MANY FLYS, SPIDERS, WASP ECT.. ARE KILLED FOR NO NEED EVERYDAY THEY ALL HAVE A PURPOSE BUT WE STILL KILL THEM.

ALL POINTS ARE VALID BUT LOOKING AT PROPERGANDA DOSNT HELP AS ALL PROPERGANDER WE SEE IS AGINST HUNTING, NOT FOR IT.

 

[Janimal]

I often wonder what sort of pleasure people get from killing beautiful wildlife .

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Its not the pleasure of the killing animals as 90% of hare ect get away un-harmed its seeing a running dog run as naturally as possible and being tested to its limit it keep sight hounds up to scratch, and keeps the aware and healthy, make there brain consentrate not like chasing a Tenis ball, its natural instinct for it to happen and a way of life for people and for some how the make money to feed there familys.

I do not consider them to be pests they are our native British wildlife and we should be proud of them .

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Rabbits are not Native British wildlife and need controlling they cause millions of pounds wrth of damage every year, but some people turn a blind eye to that and get involved before learing the facts.

free range poultry is the future, as are lambs but foxes kill plenty to survive so many that they cant eat them all, more cost for British farmers when it can be controlled.

mink arn't natural British whildlife but we see plenty about killing natural fish, birds and mamals that are native, this is because do gooders let them go because it not fair to kill them for fur, they breed like mad they have no naural preditors and now need wiping out before they desimate animals that should be her such as the water vole and birds.

for something to live somthing else has to die its natures way and all we are doing is what God intended.

have you ever seen dog at work, it the most amaizing site in the world and one that should be appriciated.

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Rachaelx..what a great post can I just say....

it is a wonderful feeling seeing my dogs work and hunt like this...and its not the joy of any kill...but just as you say seeing them doing what they were bred for. :thumbsup:

 

[melanie]

I hope you don't take offence at me asking this, Lin, but have you ever witnessed a foxhound killing a fox? For real, that is, not on a media video.
Foxhounds are very large animals and the fox is dispatched swiftly with one bite to the back of the neck by the lead hound. In the same way as a whippet will kill a rabbit.

Rabbits scream as they are caught and will also struggle until they are dead.

The other hounds are never far behind, and if the huntsman is not right with them, the pack will eat the fox then and there.  But that fox is already dead.

The other thing you have said which I find bemusing is that you think the mounted followers are "hunting down" the fox. 

The foxhounds hunt the fox, with the Huntsman in charge of the pack to direct them with his voice and with the hunting horn.  All the hounds are trained to respond to different tones and sounds of the hunting horn so that control can be kept from a distance.  There are also two or three "whips", who ride shotgun, so to speak, to the pack in order to keep them on the correct line and to avoid them running onto land where they are not allowed to go.

The followers, whether mounted or on foot, are led by the Field Master whose job it is to ensure that the followers do not cross the line of the hounds or foul the job in hand.  The main reason that people go fox hunting is to have a chance to ride their horses over farmland which is otherwise private and out of bounds to horse riders.  Both the horses and their owners enjoy this and, quite frankly, it has nothing to do with killing a fox!!!

Of course there will be some people who hunt and wish to watch hounds work and see the skill of the huntsman in directing his pack to an effective conclusion but IMHO they are the minority.

There are always two sides to every situation in life and if you think a fox doesn't stand a chance then you need to watch a real hunt (although now it's banned you can't :- " )!  I have hunted on and off for the last 30 years and I have not seen a fox killed yet.  But I have seen alot of foxes sitting on top of hedges watching the hounds go past and jumping up into hay barns where they can't be found!!! And they sit there and laugh!!!  Believe me, a strong healthy fox is more than a match for a pack of hounds  :thumbsup:

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great post :thumbsup:

i hunted with my local hunt (wynnstay) for close on 13 years, for 5 seasons i worked for the hunt master so i was very up close with hounds when changing horses, which sometimes ment i was hunting right up with the master for half an hour or so before we managed to change, i loved watching the hound work and hearing them speak, i have seen foxes killed and it is so quick if you blink you miss it, but i have also seen a fox jump out of the middle of the pack and run over their backs, by the time the hounds had had a look in eachs others mouths to see who had it the fox had long gone! iv also seen a fox stop, sit down on the top of a hill, watch the hounds untill they were close and then set off again!

i have 6 whippets and although i dont go out looking for rabbits they have caught and killed them, my old girl who is now 13, use to catch them at the yard and take them to the hay barn and eat them!

being hunt staff i have also seen many cruel things and things that are just not on, but if enough foxes arn't killed on the farmers land they will not let you cross it, of corse this was all before the ban, how if fairs for the fox now i dont know.

but the other day while out walking the dogs someone had killed a fox and hung it in a tree, the hunt use to bury any foxes that the had killed.

i think their are worst things that go on in the world then hunting with dogs!

 

[G0NZ0]

I have 3 whippets and a lurcher . they are all healthy happy pets . I am totally against any form of hunting whether it be fox or rabbit or anything else . I often wonder what sort of pleasure people get from killing beautiful wildlife . I do not consider them to be pests they are our native British wildlife and we should be proud of them . I don't really expect anyone to agree with me for fear of being ridiculed but like everyone else here I am entitled to my opinion

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I'm intrigued. Do you eat meat? If you are a vegetarian then I have no problem with your attitude.

I do however have a problem with meat eaters who are against hunting or can not kill an animal themselves. I took the decision many years ago that if I'm not prepared to kill an animal then I should not eat meat. I don't enjoy killing animals but I enjoy meat so I force myself to kill rabbits and pigeons for my pot and to salve my conscience. In my mind anything else would be hypocritical.

I also much to prefer to eat meat that I've killed myself because I believe the animal has suffered far less than in most commercial meat farming, particularly chickens, who on the whole have short and miserable lives.

By the way with regards to your comment about wildlife - are you aware that rabbits were introduced into Britain by the Romans as a meat providing animal? Therefore they are no different to any other livestock you see in our countryside.

 

[wello whippets]

''I cant go coursing because of my religion but I have considered letting my friend take him''.

parker pen,please dont think im being to invasive,but which religion prevents you from hunting?