Racing/lure coursing

[Mark Roberts]

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1 dissapointment for me yesterday was in the Racing/Lure Coursing class, talking to a few exhibiters before the class (dogs/bitchs) 1 told me that their dog had never raced or lure coursed? now this dog got placed so my question is should it be changed to make sure its a class for genuine racing/lure coursing whippets and not just a class for sub standard show breds that wouldn't win in a normal class.

also I know another bitch who's owner I talked to, I asked had it raced or lure course their reply was yes it lure coursed once with the BSFA 2 years ago I only did it so I could get her in to this class? so does 1 run in 4 years qualify a dog to compeat in the class (I THINK NOT IMO)

Come on is this rearly fair? its supposed to be a class for genuine race/coursing breds IMO the qulifying should be changed so that only dogs/bitch's that genuinely race/lure course regularly enter the class.

In the dog class I watched Dessie, Beaker & Angela Bayley had dogs in it who I know race or lure course on a regular basis but I wonder how many of the otheres realy genuinly race/lure course and how many either have never (as in the case of the person I talked to) or have only run at 1 meeting as in the other case?.

 

[Angela Bayley]

In the dog class I watched Dessie, Beaker & Angela Bayley had dogs in it who I know race or lure course on a regular basis but I wonder how many of the otheres realy genuinly race/lure course and how many either have never (as in the case of the person I talked to) or have only run at 1 meeting as in the other case?.

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Thanks for your comments Mark. IMO some of the entries for the racing/coursing classes at Crufts and other Ch shows have in the past been suspect.

Didn't know you were watching :b glad you could come

Angela

and WHEN are fosse data going to get the full whippet results up?????

 

[Mark Roberts]

Thanks for your comments Mark. IMO some of the entries for the racing/coursing classes at Crufts and other Ch shows have in the past been suspect

Past you a couple of times, but you seemed busy with the dog each time so I didnt want to pester you while you were busy.

 

[Mark Roberts]

maybe you should have to get a letter from a racing or coursing club stateing what you have done that year to be eligable

But a letters only any good if the stewards actualy check them?

 

[~elizabeth~]

Congratulations to everyone, (particularly to Guto's half-brother Dejare Cobweb for his VHC - I did try to find you and Joy Debbie to say 'Hello' ).

1 dissapointment for me yesterday was in the Racing/Lure Coursing class, talking to a few  exhibiters before the class (dogs/bitchs) 1 told me that their dog had never raced or lure coursed? now this dog got placed so my question is should it be changed to make sure its a class for genuine racing/lure coursing whippets and not just a class for sub standard show breds that wouldn't win in a normal class.

That point has already been made on another thread Mark. But apparently these classes are just a 'novelty' :- "

Racing/coursing qualification...

 

[Angela Bayley]

Thanks for your comments Mark. IMO some of the entries for the racing/coursing classes at Crufts and other Ch shows have in the past been suspect

Past you a couple of times, but you seemed busy with the dog each time so I didnt want to pester you while you were busy.

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For me I truly wish racing dogs were better represented in the show ring at all shows. This is our heriitage, not the carthorses that represent our breed in the show ring now. Take a look at

http://www.freewebs.com/niisyfwhippets/niisyfoto.htm

where was this beautiful dog yesterday??? (sorry this doesn't appear to be the best link there is a better version on the website I saw this morning)

 

[Mark Roberts]

For me I truly wish racing dogs were better represented in the show ring at all shows. This is our heriitage, not the carthorses that represent our breed in the show ring now

I fully agree Angela, unfortunatly I know most racers feel that they wouldnt get a look in against show bred whippets in the class.

rightly or wrongly racing/show lines as you know have split into 2 destinct groups like the greyhounds did (racing/show lines)

unfortunatly race breds wouldnt be able to compeat in the ring in the racing & working class as was shown yesterday, Beakers black dog Otto who races regularly, lure courses and was top dog at the Northwest Lure Coursing a few years back didnt get placed yesterday which OK thats far enough if he's beaten by better dogs that race/lure course but as i've stated I was told by the owner of 1 of the dogs that did get placed that their dog had never raced or lure coursed in its life?

 

[Lakey]

Thanks for your comments Mark. IMO some of the entries for the racing/coursing classes at Crufts and other Ch shows have in the past been suspect

Past you a couple of times, but you seemed busy with the dog each time so I didnt want to pester you while you were busy.

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For me I truly wish racing dogs were better represented in the show ring at all shows. This is our heriitage, not the carthorses that represent our breed in the show ring now. Take a look at

http://www.freewebs.com/niisyfwhippets/niisyfoto.htm

where was this beautiful dog yesterday??? (sorry this doesn't appear to be the best link there is a better version on the website I saw this morning)

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Got to agree with Angela here :thumbsup:

While watching crufts the presenters harp on about the judges looking at the dogs and judging them on what they were origianaly designed and bred to do

What utter rubbish :x

Show greyhounds dont look like the could get off the settee and catch a cold never mind go round a race track or catch live prey!!

And the nearest thing to the orignal working mans whippet was the Italian greyhounds in the toy group :rant:

All this supposedly makes up the greatest dog show in the world :rant:

 

[larruu]

1 dissapointment for me yesterday was in the Racing/Lure Coursing class, talking to a few  exhibiters before the class (dogs/bitchs) 1 told me that their dog had never raced or lure coursed? now this dog got placed so my question is should it be changed to make sure its a class for genuine racing/lure coursing whippets and not just a class for sub standard show breds that wouldn't win in a normal class.also I know another bitch who's owner I talked to, I asked had it raced or lure course their reply was yes it lure coursed once with the BSFA 2 years ago I only did it so I could get her in to this class? so does 1 run in 4 years qualify a dog to compeat in the class (I THINK NOT IMO)

Come on is this rearly fair? its supposed to be a class for genuine race/coursing breds IMO the qulifying should be changed so that only dogs/bitch's that genuinely race/lure course regularly enter the class.

In the dog class I watched Dessie, Beaker & Angela Bayley had dogs in it who I know race or lure course on a regular basis but I wonder how many of the otheres realy genuinly race/lure course and how many either have never (as in the case of the person I talked to) or have only run at 1 meeting as in the other case?.

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I dont know about the entries in the bitch class for racing/lurecoursing but as regards the dogs, you've already vouched for Dessie, Beaker and Angela Bailey. Liz Third has already said her piece and of the others Penbriar Foxhunter has run regularly and with merit at last seasons BSFA . Spiders N Spoons runs less frequently but has appeared at BSFA on occasions and has won best whippet (and possibly best in field- cant rightly recall now ) i think Jarmane Toot the Flute for Shuleah has also won a best whippet a few years back when the BSFA ran at

Cholmondley Castle ( Angela Bayley may be able to confirm that) and Arjuna Joe Bloggs was top whippet and top overall hound for the 2005 BSFA season so the dogs at least IMO all had a right to enter. As regards your comment about sub standard show types, apart from Dessies JW winning dog and Beakers OTO the others had all shown in earlier classes and thus must have qualified in the usual way.

 

[Mark Roberts]

THe person concerned told me in front of a witness that their dog had never raced or lure coursed? i'd asked because I was interested in how many actualy raced/lure coursed regularly and how many either didnt or had only run at say 1 event.

IMO maybe there should be a class for true race bred whippets with some qualifying method where by a dog must of won (not just taken part) in a racing /lure coursing meeting in lets say the previous 2 months prior to the show or maybe must of run at say 15 race meeting/ lure coursing meetings in the previous 12 months and must be able to provide proof from a club secreaty of an affiliated club or recognised organisation.

 

[beaker]

1 dissapointment for me yesterday was in the Racing/Lure Coursing class, talking to a few  exhibiters before the class (dogs/bitchs) 1 told me that their dog had never raced or lure coursed? now this dog got placed so my question is should it be changed to make sure its a class for genuine racing/lure coursing whippets and not just a class for sub standard show breds that wouldn't win in a normal class.also I know another bitch who's owner I talked to, I asked had it raced or lure course their reply was yes it lure coursed once with the BSFA 2 years ago I only did it so I could get her in to this class? so does 1 run in 4 years qualify a dog to compeat in the class (I THINK NOT IMO)

Come on is this rearly fair? its supposed to be a class for genuine race/coursing breds IMO the qulifying should be changed so that only dogs/bitch's that genuinely race/lure course regularly enter the class.

In the dog class I watched Dessie, Beaker & Angela Bayley had dogs in it who I know race or lure course on a regular basis but I wonder how many of the otheres realy genuinly race/lure course and how many either have never (as in the case of the person I talked to) or have only run at 1 meeting as in the other case?.

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I dont know about the entries in the bitch class for racing/lurecoursing but as regards the dogs, you've already vouched for Dessie, Beaker and Angela Bailey. Liz Third has already said her piece and of the others Penbriar Foxhunter has run regularly and with merit at last seasons BSFA . Spiders N Spoons runs less frequently but has appeared at BSFA on occasions and has won best whippet (and possibly best in field- cant rightly recall now ) i think Jarmane Toot the Flute for Shuleah has also won a best whippet a few years back when the BSFA ran at

Cholmondley Castle ( Angela Bayley may be able to confirm that) and Arjuna Joe Bloggs was top whippet and top overall hound for the 2005 BSFA season so the dogs at least IMO all had a right to enter. As regards your comment about sub standard show types, apart from Dessies JW winning dog and Beakers OTO the others had all shown in earlier classes and thus must have qualified in the usual way.

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Oto had qualified in the usual way too but with my other dog in an earlier class and me being on standby to show my friends dog, i wouldn't have had time to get him in an earlier class :thumbsup:

i'm just glad he can still do it and love him whatever :wub:

it was Oto's last Crufts this year as apart from the odd coloured class i'm retiring him from the ring, bless him he can't be arsed showing off any more :lol:

 

[larruu]

THe person concerned told me in front of a witness that their dog had never raced or lure coursed? i'd asked because I was interested in how many actualy raced/lure coursed regularly and how many either didnt or had only run at say 1 event.
IMO maybe there should be a class for true race bred whippets with some qualifying method where by a dog must of won (not just taken part) in a racing /lure coursing meeting in lets say the previous 2 months prior to the show or maybe must of run at say 15 race meeting/ lure coursing meetings in the previous 12 months and must be able to provide proof from a club secreaty of an affiliated club or recognised organisation.

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Was this by the dog ring or the bitch ring ? cos as i stated in my previous post all the dogs were there by rights (imo) and if the person was about to show a dog - god knows why they would make such a statement !! what you say about race bred whippets is fine obviously the two month thing wouldn't work because entries close about two months before the show and you'd have to travel hard to find 15 lure coursing meetings but thats just nit picking. trouble is as much as it saddens

those who want to do more than one thing with their dogs there is a division between the showing and racing/coursing types as it stands you just have to get on with it. If i want to lurecourse my dog then i have to accept that he is going to meet with dogs specifically bred for that sphere and the same in reverse has to be

accepted by the racer/lurecoursing fraternity if they choose to show.

By the way Beaker, i was not intimating that Otis hadn't qualified.My apologies if i gave that impression

 

[Paula Roberts]

So shouldnt the judge, judge the race/lure coursing class on how he would expect a race/lure coursing dog to look. :- "

 

[Millie]

So shouldnt the judge, judge the race/lure coursing class on how he would expect a race/lure coursing dog to look. :- "

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The judge is required to judge all the classes/dogs by the breed standard, as set out by the kennel club.

The standard is supposed to be the blue print of all whippets !

 

[larruu]

So shouldnt the judge, judge the race/lure coursing class on how he would expect a race/lure coursing dog to look. :- "

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A show judge can only judge on his/her interpretation of the breed standard. They are judging to that standard wether the exhibit is show , race or coursing bred , the only alternatives to that are - two judges,as you get at a few whippet shows or just drop the class altogether due to its decreasing relevance.

 

[Mark Roberts]

The judge is required to judge all the classes/dogs by the breed standard, as set out by the kennel club

[SIZE=21pt]LOL[/SIZE]

i'll bring the measuring stick next time then.

Makes me laugh we all agree that whippets evolved from the northern mining towns? now from the pics i've seen in books I cant remember seeing any perfect rose petal ears ect ect quite the opposite pricked ears cow hocks ect so is the breed standard realy a true representation of the breed or is the breed being bred away from the original type whippet to fit the standard?.

What came 1st the whippet or the breed standard? and when did the original looks of the old time miners whippets get done away with pricked ears ect?.

 

[Mark Roberts]

They are judging to that standard wether the exhibit is show , race or coursing bred , the only alternatives to that are - two judges

Totaly agree, I know a few whippet judges who race regularly so maybe 1 of those would be a good judge for racing/lure coursing classes that way they could look at conformation more as a fit for the job basis than stricktly to the breed standard.

Don't get me wronge i'm not knocking show people in anyway as to do the miles involved and the cost involved they show great devotion to their hobbhy and for that I admire them my only quiery is should racing & lure coursing classes not be aimed more directly at the dogs that compeat regularly at those events as Beakers, Angelas, Liz's ect do (and fair play to them all) or should those who have never or only taken part in 1 enent in say 3 years realy be classed as a racing/lure coursing dog just to get into the class?.

 

[Millie]

The judge is required to judge all the classes/dogs by the breed standard, as set out by the kennel club

[SIZE=21pt]LOL[/SIZE]

i'll bring the measuring stick next time then.

Makes me laugh we all agree that whippets evolved from the northern mining towns? now from the pics i've seen in books I cant remember seeing any perfect rose petal ears ect ect quite the opposite pricked ears cow hocks ect so is the breed standard realy a true representation of the breed or is the breed being bred away from the original type whippet to fit the standard?.

What came 1st the whippet or the breed standard? and when did the original looks of the old time miners whippets get done away with pricked ears ect?.

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Agree Mark ! The breed standard is only a few words and open to so many differant interpretations. Yes over the years it has been modified to meet the envolvement of the breed, yes it happens to everything.......... we could still look like apes (w00t) but what would happen to the breed without it ? :unsure:

 

[Millie]

Here is a few pics of whippets in history, most I think still fit the standard :thumbsup:

 

[Mark Roberts]

well lets make the 2008 racing & lure coursing group a good 1, lets get as many racing/working lines entered as possible.

heres 2 that might just make an appearance so come on those in the know do you have to qualify for the racing & lure Coursing class or do we just turn enter.

Parkstone Sweet Ebony (WCRCh Fine & Dandy x Parkstone Sweet Dreams)

Parkstone Take A Chance (WCRCh Chase The Pioed Piper x Parkstone Taboo) Red Jacket

White Collar

(come on Julie get those 2 of yours booked in and Lesley & Andy.