Iggys

[nina]

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Still waiting for the information on health problems Nina...

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I only give help & advice to genuine caring people :thumbsup:

Sorry to disappoint others (w00t)

Nighty night

 

[~elizabeth~]

I think nearly everyone on K9 is a genuine and caring dog owner, obviously you disagree if you won't share information with any of us. If you gave us some detailed, verified information to refer to we could make our own minds up; we might even agree with you. :thumbsup:

 

[nina]

I think nearly everyone on K9 is a genuine and caring dog owner. If you gave us some material to refer to we could make our own minds up; we might even agree with you.

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From personal experience i doubt it & i wouldnt waste my breath!

I'm not here to flog peoples litters.

 

[~elizabeth~]

Neither am I, I don't know Tanya and have no plans to acquire a Whiggy, but some valid and interesting points of debate have been raised and I can't see why an expert such as yourself is so reluctant to contribute information to the discussion :unsure:

 

[nina]

Me an expert ??? According to some i doubt it?

I dont proclaim to be anything. I just have an opinion as many others do.

 

[OEH]

Nina I think it would be truely helpful for you to tell us about the health problems inherent in IGs. It is clearly in the interest of the breed for people to know as much as possible to avoid further problems like the one you see in this situation.

 

[urchin]

Nina I think it would be truely helpful for you to tell us about the health problems inherent in IGs.  It is clearly in the interest of the breed for people to know as much as possible to avoid further problems like the one you see in this situation.

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Now OEH, don't be silly! Why would any of them want to do that, when the mighty elevation of 'knowing the mysteries that only the serious know' is so enjoyable?

Far better to carp at others than actually share something constructive - wouldn't want to do that now would we? Goodness, people might even be able to express their opinion then without someone playing the 'you don't know what your talking about' card. (w00t)

 

[~Sarah~]

Okay. these are the health problems in question:
"PRA: This disease causes blindness in affected IGs between 3-5 years old.  PRA is a recessive disease so it is possible to breed two healthy IGs together and still produce a PRA positive offspring. This means that responsible breeders must not only test the parents' eye health, but also study and research the pedigrees behind the prospective parents to minimize the risk of combining two high probability carriers.

There are many other eye problems that are widespread among all the dog breeds.  IGs used for breeding should have an annual exam done by a veterinary ophthalmologist (this is an eye specialist - an exam done by a normal veterinary surgeon is not sufficient evidence to clear an IG for breeding).

Autoimmune Thyroiditis:  This condition is very widespread amongst all dog breeds; the IG is no exception.  Thyroid and thyroid hormone malfunction can cause a vast array of medical complaints in the IG. Not much is known about the inheritance of this disease and there are contributing environmental and stress factors but fortunately we now have a good blood test (TgAA) that is able to diagnose this condition before clinical symptoms become obvious. 

Patella Luxation:  This condition refers to dislocating knee caps in the hind legs.  There are various grades of patella luxation but all are an unsoundness. IGs used for breeding should have sound patellas determined by a veterinary exam.

Seizures:  We don't know what causes these.  There are different types, can range from mild to severe, and they may have multiple causes.  Unfortunately, there are no pre-breeding diagnostic tests for this problem and it is widespread throughout the gene pool.  Obviously no IG with a history of seizures should be bred.

Fractures:    It is possible that most IGs fracture by accident rather than as the result of a genetic disorder.  Young IGs don't know their own limitations and even the healthiest, sturdiest IG can fracture.  However, some unfortunate IGs seem to have extra fragile legs; the legs may have trouble healing and they may rebreak easily even with the best of care.  We don't know why this is.  It is possible there is a genetic basis for this problem."

PRA, though not unknown in whippets is thankfully rare; ditto luxating patellas and seizures. There is thought to be a genetic component to IG fractures, but I cannot see that crossing with whippets would exaccerbate this. Autoimmune disease; the test they mention only identifies anti-thyroid antibodies before symptoms, it does not identify the genetic component, so carriers will be missed anyway. So, apart from personal distaste, I cannot see why such a out cross could be anything other than beneficial to these puppies health quite frankly. We are lucky in whippets to have a healthy breed that has historically had a wide genepool, in which extreme linebreeding has not been widely practiced until recently; it's a shame that the same cannot be said of Iggies. By the time a breed needs costly health screening it is in genetic freefall 

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Thank you for attempting to bring this thread back on track with some useful and informative points about health problems in Iggies. :thumbsup: I too would also be interested to find out more about these lovely dogs and their health problems.

 

[~elizabeth~]

I too would also be interested to find out more about these lovely dogs and their health problems.

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So would I. The last newsletter I received when I was a member of the IG society had a very interesting survey of health problems in the breed, mainly the issues mentioned here although I also remember some discussion of the increasing incidence of leukemia too. I'll try and dig it out, unless anyone else can find it first; it would date from around 1995-6 :unsure:

I'm not disagreeing; from little I know I agree that Iggies are a specialist breed, not suited to the inexperienced or casual dog owner. But surely the best way to ensure that they don't end up in the wrong homes and ultimately in rescue is to have a frank debate about potential behavioural and health problems? :unsure:

 

[~elizabeth~]

I see they have done another more recent survey in 2004.

Graph one:ITALIAN GREYHOUNDS OWNED FORMORE THAN TEN YEARS

Graph 2 ITALIAN GREYHOUNDS OWNED FOR FEWER THAN TEN YEARS

from IG Club - focus on health

 

[OEH]

American Italian greyhound site general

Deafness

Patellar luxation

Seizure

Baldness

Gum disease

Vitreous degeneration

Mange

PRA

Legge Perthe's

von Willebrand's

American health survey

Also apparently (according topet planet) thrombocytopaenia however I can only find details of this in humans Thrombocytopenia; Corneal dystrophy;

optic nerve hypoplasia which I can only find details of in other breed sits so not sure how relevant this isoptic nerve hypoplasia.

Hope this is of some interest.

 

[~elizabeth~]

Thanks for that Olivia :thumbsup:

I am surprised to see von Willebrands is an issue in IGs; we have a friend who lost 2 sheltie pups in succession to VW (both under 6 months); although it is a different form of the disease, as a lifelong Sheltie enthusiast, our friend had not realised it was an issue in her breed until this point; the breeders who supplied the pups did not have the honesty to mention their lines carried it, and it was only after speaking to genuine, frank and ethical breeders that she eventually found one that appears healthy (but not before losing yet another one to the side effects of congenital dwarfism). These experiences really made me question the ethics of reducing the gene pool in pedigree dogs, especially within minority breeds (and a testing programme that excludes yet more individuals from the gene pool may result in a proliferation of additional problems in the long run).

The only way to approach these difficult issues is via honest and open discussion and sharing of information.

 

[posh totty]

thank you for the well balanced and imformative replies, im sure these will help many people interested in italian greyhounds :thumbsup:

 

[imperative]

Very informative stuff! Interesting reading.Thanks

 

[doris]

I have my own thoughts on this thread, and I'm going to keep most of them private, as it appears near-on impossible for anyone to ask a question or give an opinion with getting either ridiculed, slagged-off or getting a verbal kicking

but I do feel the need to point a couple of things out:

1. all this started because of one quote and a sad face icon - maybe blown a bit out of proportion?

Someone is advertising Igggy x whippet puppies on epupz

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2. I own iggies! I am not a snob, I'm not a breeder, and I'm not one of the mystical, all-knowing, information-keeping, question-ignoring iggie owners that keep getting mentioned. I don't know everything about them but I know I have two happy, mad, much-loved iggies. Iggies are not small whippets, I know that, but - and I am so going to get slated for this! - IGGIES ARE DOGS!!!!!!!! They are difficult and challenging and different in a hundred ways, just as other 'specialist breeds' are, but, at the end of the day, italian greyhounds are dogs!

 

[posh totty]

I have my own thoughts on this thread, and I'm going to keep most of them private, as it appears near-on impossible for anyone to ask a question or give an opinion with getting either ridiculed, slagged-off or getting a verbal kicking
but I do feel the need to point a couple of things out:

1. all this started because of one quote and a sad face icon - maybe blown a bit out of proportion?

Someone is advertising Igggy x whippet puppies on epupz

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2. I own iggies! I am not a snob, I'm not a breeder, and I'm not one of the mystical, all-knowing, information-keeping, question-ignoring iggie owners that keep getting mentioned. I don't know everything about them but I know I have two happy, mad, much-loved iggies. Iggies are not small whippets, I know that, but - and I am so going to get slated for this! - IGGIES ARE DOGS!!!!!!!! They are difficult and challenging and different in a hundred ways, just as other 'specialist breeds' are, but, at the end of the day, italian greyhounds are dogs!

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doris your reply is well balanced , you have your own views and values which may differ from the next , we dont all have the same opinion , the world would be a very sad place if we all did, but at the end of the day with any dog be it the most crossbredd mongrel or the most pure of pure breds surely it is in everyones best interest to give a dog the very best of homes and upbringings, all dogs what ever breed deserve no less, my mating WAS NOT planned i was in the middle of starting racing her and showing, which both of us were very much enjoying, it was thro not wanting my dogs left alone i had my mum here looking after them and as the bitch has dry silent seasons i was in discussions with the vet to spey at end of nov, but regardless of how and why it has happened, it has done so now my part is to home these pups in the right homes for them, as for the health problems in iggys these have been explained to all callers and to further recognise breed faults i have also directed them to various sites and orgs to make a more balanced view, the pups are having full health checks and vet certs, no one can predict a future but what you can do is put prevention steps in place and offer balanced informative views.

i will add that had it not been for outcrossing italians we would not have the modern day whippet

 

[unwanted]

yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

 

[unwanted]

these dogs sound like they bred for a vets bank account

 

[posh totty]

at the end of the day it is the responsible thing to do by having full vet checks and home checks carried out, doesnt matter about what cost it is, as you well know 3 having been given to people at NO COST and it is the dogs interest i have at heart.

o btw a bitch iggy being advertised by breeder with endorsements at £900 :- "

 

[stormydog]

TANYA.. i thought you had buyers for those pups as soon as you knew the bitch was pregnant ? its a pity it wasnt another whippet that was left with mabel as soon as people hear igs they think of brittle little things not designed for the field even if theyre crossed with a whippet. hopefully someone wanting a house pet will see the EPUPZ advert. though jeezzzzz what a price youve got on them !! bit cheeky tanya

j hn