Sup Championship Run Offs

[sadieandco]

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Some people also pull out of supreme run offs as they feel their dogs have done enough with maybe 3 runs to get the said title, and even if in 2 groups these people may well still feel the same and withdraw if they felt the next run was just an extra run if they had a good idea they wouldnt win and then the finals would still not be fully contended !!!!! :wacko:

 

[mutley]

well said :thumbsup:

 

[Vicky]

Don't know about the bigger dogs not being good enough, i would tend to think it's the other way round, the little uns these days are a LOT faster than they were years ago.

 

[Karen-Coral]

If your dog is fast enough to win it will the sad thing is that only one at each event can no matter what way you handicap

I pull my dogs out now as they are getting to the end of their racing life but i never pulled Fluke out of bends even when she won sup she had five hard races in the day to win it---

or straights unless she got injured same went for Coral and they both won supremes at many opens sometimes i pulled one so they did not have to run against each other but Fluke at 26lb -28lb and Coral 19-20lb could both hold their own with any at that time and did so on many occasions ----they also lost quite a few but thats racing --you cant win them all --- I do like different formats just for a change though ---

steve

 

[DavidH]

must agree with vicky there are some fantastic light weights racing. one 22 lber nearly as fast as the scratch last year at some meetings unbelievable,and unbeatable (w00t) :thumbsup:

 

[huggybear]

Don't know about the bigger dogs not being good enough, i would tend to think it's the other way round, the little uns these days are a LOT faster than they were years ago.

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ive raced 30 years and seen a few fast little ones take my word for it they are not faster and a few fast big uns and they are not faster .you had a lot more dogs to beat then 100 dogs raced at cannock wrc club meeting 75 was normal on a sunday

 

[Vicky]

Don't know about the bigger dogs not being good enough, i would tend to think it's the other way round, the little uns these days are a LOT faster than they were years ago.

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ive raced 30 years and seen a few fast little ones take my word for it they are not faster and a few fast big uns and they are not faster .you had a lot more dogs to beat then 100 dogs raced at cannock wrc club meeting 75 was normal on a sunday

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Going off the times they did 30 years ago??

 

[john m]

Don't know about the bigger dogs not being good enough, i would tend to think it's the other way round, the little uns these days are a LOT faster than they were years ago.

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ive raced 30 years and seen a few fast little ones take my word for it they are not faster and a few fast big uns and they are not faster .you had a lot more dogs to beat then 100 dogs raced at cannock wrc club meeting 75 was normal on a sunday

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I find it hard to believe that dogs were faster in the good old days than they are now, after all, breeders have been breeding for speed in this sport and still are.

 

[DavidH]

anybody got any times from years back be interesting.

 

[Karen-Coral]

I was out of racing for thirty years and the dogs we run now are much faster you never heard of a dog breaking nine seconds in the past even the big ones and the all england rag racing champion Yellow Rose which was a Lancaster Dog never got anywhere near the times they do now thats a fact---if they could break 9 seconds they were open class at any weight-- the likes of Blackie/Cherry/Good as Gold/Wishy Was/Sportsman /SAG/ to name just a few would never get close to the best there is today granted there were lots more dogs as i have said many times before at LWRC we had over a hundred twice a week but i used to handicap them and i know they were no where near as fast------even if you take in to account that there were no digital watches at the time --

steve

 

[tinarpoole]

My own soft touch was a 15/16 lbs and a phenonemoen winning the true test of consistency 'The Whippet news Top Ten' with the handicap of being based in London. She won the Midlands Triple Crown over 175 at Hinkley and 100 dog open at Woolsthorpe over 200 yards. She consistently run 8.60/8.70 s over 150 yards. There is no way the smaller dogs of yesteryear are slower than todays runners and anybody lucky enough to see the likes of Roberta D, Cherry, Dasher, Wendygo, IBM, What a maid & Kelly Gold would agree. By the way the best of the lot was Another Maid who i was lucky enough to house for a sort period.

 

[mutley]

i dont think they have got faster ,just less around racing now

 

[jeffb]

i was also around to see another maid run and i agree she was the best iv,e seen i dropped out of the sport for a lot off years but came back into it ,and when i did i could,nt believe the times the dogs where doing they were fantastic iam not knocking the dogs of the passed as i watched great h/weights like rch maskori rch devils angel,rch romany,rch janes pace scratch dogs such wish again[the best that there as been]mad era,blue wish, mooney etc etc etc

i clocked these dogs in there prime and ive clocked the best that are around now a i know the dogs have got faster in all sizes of dogs.. as ive said iam not knocking the dogs of the past but with breeding,feeding,training regimes and euipment the breed as got faster if it has,nt breeders and trainers had better go back to there drawing boards too see what has gone wrong over the last 30years. The best person in my opinion to ask is linda windell she,s had some of the greatest dogs in our sport from double handful to her present dogs now if anybody as ideas of dogs getting faster it would be linda

 

[Vicky]

i dont think they have got faster ,just less around racing now

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Really? Although i don't see what the amount of runners has to do with their speed.

I was talking about the smaller dogs originally and how much faster the 18lbers are now - something like Swift Holly who did astounding times and wiped the floor with other very fast bitches of the same era, would in my eyes have left all of the good lightweights of yesteryear for dust.

I'm gobsmacked so many think that whippets haven't got faster over the years, i have handicap books from when Good as Gold was running, he would not live with something of the same weight nowadays - say Colorado in his prime.

Soz Gaz looks like i'm aiming it at you :lol: :thumbsup:

 

[wild whippies]

I'd of expected times to improve in their years in the breed, otherwise folk would seriously need to be rethinking their breeding programmes as it's meerly a process of evolution for racing dogs to become faster as a whole. Not only that but why bother lining the best with the best if it's not going to produce something that's faster?

I think many can quote a certain dog that was phenomenal way back when but I can't help feel that these dogs would have far more competitive races these days with little margin for error.

Has anyone got their Pauline Wilson book to hand? Might be useful in this thread.

 

[jeffb]

i dont think they have got faster ,just less around racing now

don,t see the reasoning not faster just less around this does,nt make the dogs any slower these days because theres less dogs around

 

[john m]

The older times dog that were winning in those days were just that bit special, like the good dogs nowadays, they are just a bit better than the average dog but i would also point out that no trap board assistance was available, so being able to trap without assistance must have been a winner for a start, I am not knocking the older type racing whippet but i doubt that the champions of 30 or so years ago would be able to run with the modern day champs and win but one never knows and we never will. :cheers: :luck:

 

[mutley]

fastest no limiter and forty pounder ive ever seen and theres some gooduns about are jacks back and sonof abitch so they wouldnt be as fast as dogs now :blink: mmmmmmmmm bet they were and vicky no need to say sos i wrote my post arsse first meant to say that not so long ago you had open class dogs and club dogs now they are all open class or people think they are :- " due to fewer numbers of dogs :thumbsup: oh shit ive done it again (w00t) faster than 20 year ago maybe but not any faster than good dogs in the last 10 or 12 years

 

[huggybear]

little jim 19lb clocked 8.50 over 150 yrds at measham won the first scottish whippet derby, a few weeks later won sup dog then beat the bitch in run off 7 races in one day. something like 350 dogs in these two events to win the top prize.In my opinion dogs are not faster .....

 

[jade scott]

This is Peter posting, this subject is raised every few years and the same answers come back each time, from the same people. If its not broken then dont fix it for example. Well in my personal opinion it is broken, when regarding the straights. however lightweights are still winning supreems on the bends, Drams Queen 17-18 lbs, rapid stag 20.

But it is the straights that nowdays are almost without exception won by 18-23 dogs in weight. What Tony has said is the only way to attain a fair handicap for all. The best dog will still win no matter what the mark is set as long as it is fair to all, this is not the case at present. Look at the traps for a start. a 32 lb dog has to watch the lure go past, the wait for another 16 yards before opening if it races a 16lb dog. By the time it opens the Scr dog has hit the fronts about ten times, his muzzel is broke, and he is bleeding from the nose. while the light weight gets a clean break almost every time. I cannot be certain but I am pretty sure that it was because we used to run Southern Scott off in puppy finals that made him not try when running from the back, as he used to suffer from above.

His times were never the same over the same distances, he was always slower from the back, yet run him with dogs his weight or 3yards lighter he would run to win in a faster time than from well back. As Vicky said it is all to easy to run the heart out of a heavy weight. I am not running at present, but it is has been a poor spectacle over the last few years to watch two dogs run off for supeeme in what is meant to be whippet racings biggest events, with three other champions watching from the sidelines.

Whippet racing needs to look at new ways to help maintain and if possible grow numbers of people in the sport. One last point I find strange is if you looked at the total number of lightweights in the sport it would be around the 20% mark I would think, yet this percentage runs under rules that are unfair for the other 80%. Like Steve says why not give it a try at some club meetings to get an idea of how it could work.

Lastly. I wish all racers a great newyear with injury free racing in 2008