New Bwra Ruling

[ahorsnall]

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dark peak molli stag and mrs fletwood are the progeny :thumbsup:

and cant be mated back to a ghd for two generations suger fire is 1st generation

Chris,i'm :sweating: now :lol: Dark Peak, etc are the 1st generation out of the whippet cross greyhound.SugarFire is out of Dark Peake so he is the 2nd generation

the proposal says after the out cross the progent cant be mated to a ghd for two generations i might be thick but can count to two lol :clown:

Question for you then,Do you consider the outcross to be the original mating of the whippet to the greyhound?

You tell me if anybody calls you thick and i'll sort em out o

karen it does say after the out cross the progeny can not be mated to a ghd for two generations.just think people should know when looking at stud dogs :wacko:

 

[ahorsnall]

It's interesting how many of us have differing theories as to how to interpret the proposal. I did draw up a simple instruction but to be honest, I'd quite like Marie to detail her interpretation seeing as though it was her proposal, after all how will any of us know if we're correct in our own interpretations?

OK Jacs, just for you and any one else who is genuinely interested I'll try again but I do have to say that as certain people want I am starting to lose the will to live but before I do can I just say that most people seem to have a very firm grasp of just what this proposal is and how to work it out, some of them just dont like it.

So here goes once more with feeling.....this is an example

say I have a non ped dog called Blogs and I have the opportunity to put him to a nubile young full greyhound bitch called Fast Fifi and I want to know if the BWRA would register puppies from this mating

Simple answer...if Blogs's mum or dad or any of his grandparents(not great grandparents,gg grandparents or even my grandparents :lol: ) were a full greyhound then the answer is no the BWRA would not register the pups. Anything else is fine and just as it has always been.

Both Chris and I have both said that we would like to see all puppies born or concieved before this proposal on 14/12/08 registered and for that to apply to both our proposal and the weight cap to be fair to all.

:thumbsup: yes marie i do think they should yes

 

[gary farmer]

Why is it important to certain people to continue this theme that people are confused by the proposal? Answer............cos they want people to think it isn't workable. If i was anyone on K9 I would give up trying to answer any queries but let people just refer back to extremely simple explanations put up on here. The more emotional they make this issue, the more they will suceed at getting the proposal overturned. Let them talk to themselves, sounds like they dont want to listen to the explanations anyway.
chris

Chis i will continue the theme as you call it until i now myself and others it affects can register the pups already born this year , so have been asked including registrar why i did not register them last year, i must point out that one litter was born in sep 08 and the bwra books where closed in oct 08 , so the pups where to young to have there vaccination,

i also have never been a one for starting pups off at a young age due to accidents especially the one with greyhound blood in them

I don't want yours or anyone else's proposal over turned , i am more than willing to abide by the new rules and bred the way it says ..

Would just like answers to what i can bred or cannot

 

[tony warren]

OK HERE GOES IVE JUST BEEN TOLD THAT THE PROPOSER OF THIS HAS NOT BEEN IN THE GAME LONG TRUE OR NOT I DONT KNOW BUT IT IS QUITE A COMPLEX ISSUE TO BE PUT FORWARD BY SOMEONE NEW TO RACING OR IS THERE A X-FILES GOING HERE SOMEONE WHO ANIT GOT THE BALLS TO LOAD THE GUN BUT GET ANOTHER TO FIRE IT

 

[Paws123]

It's interesting how many of us have differing theories as to how to interpret the proposal. I did draw up a simple instruction but to be honest, I'd quite like Marie to detail her interpretation seeing as though it was her proposal, after all how will any of us know if we're correct in our own interpretations?

OK Jacs, just for you and any one else who is genuinely interested I'll try again but I do have to say that as certain people want I am starting to lose the will to live but before I do can I just say that most people seem to have a very firm grasp of just what this proposal is and how to work it out, some of them just dont like it.

So here goes once more with feeling.....this is an example

say I have a non ped dog called Blogs and I have the opportunity to put him to a nubile young full greyhound bitch called Fast Fifi and I want to know if the BWRA would register puppies from this mating

Simple answer...if Blogs's mum or dad or any of his grandparents(not great grandparents,gg grandparents or even my grandparents :lol: ) were a full greyhound then the answer is no the BWRA would not register the pups. Anything else is fine and just as it has always been.

Both Chris and I have both said that we would like to see all puppies born or concieved before this proposal on 14/12/08 registered and for that to apply to both our proposal and the weight cap to be fair to all.

So am i right that these stud dogs could not line a greyhound

including magical dreams (ive not done his ped yet) and if so the offspring are unble to

register

same to this bitch and greyhound stud dog

 

[wild whippies]

It's interesting how many of us have differing theories as to how to interpret the proposal. I did draw up a simple instruction but to be honest, I'd quite like Marie to detail her interpretation seeing as though it was her proposal, after all how will any of us know if we're correct in our own interpretations?

OK Jacs, just for you and any one else who is genuinely interested I'll try again but I do have to say that as certain people want I am starting to lose the will to live but before I do can I just say that most people seem to have a very firm grasp of just what this proposal is and how to work it out, some of them just dont like it.

So here goes once more with feeling.....this is an example

say I have a non ped dog called Blogs and I have the opportunity to put him to a nubile young full greyhound bitch called Fast Fifi and I want to know if the BWRA would register puppies from this mating

Simple answer...if Blogs's mum or dad or any of his grandparents(not great grandparents,gg grandparents or even my grandparents :lol: ) were a full greyhound then the answer is no the BWRA would not register the pups. Anything else is fine and just as it has always been.

Both Chris and I have both said that we would like to see all puppies born or concieved before this proposal on 14/12/08 registered and for that to apply to both our proposal and the weight cap to be fair to all.

Cheers Marie :thumbsup: Well put and I agree totally.

I must admit I thought it would of been simple common sense to introduce a breeding rule that applied to only dogs born after it's introduction and the same went for the cap. Trying to impose rules on dogs in existance is like shutting the door after the horse has bolted.

 

[ahorsnall]

It's interesting how many of us have differing theories as to how to interpret the proposal. I did draw up a simple instruction but to be honest, I'd quite like Marie to detail her interpretation seeing as though it was her proposal, after all how will any of us know if we're correct in our own interpretations?

OK Jacs, just for you and any one else who is genuinely interested I'll try again but I do have to say that as certain people want I am starting to lose the will to live but before I do can I just say that most people seem to have a very firm grasp of just what this proposal is and how to work it out, some of them just dont like it.

So here goes once more with feeling.....this is an example

say I have a non ped dog called Blogs and I have the opportunity to put him to a nubile young full greyhound bitch called Fast Fifi and I want to know if the BWRA would register puppies from this mating

Simple answer...if Blogs's mum or dad or any of his grandparents(not great grandparents,gg grandparents or even my grandparents :lol: ) were a full greyhound then the answer is no the BWRA would not register the pups. Anything else is fine and just as it has always been.

Both Chris and I have both said that we would like to see all puppies born or concieved before this proposal on 14/12/08 registered and for that to apply to both our proposal and the weight cap to be fair to all.

So am i right that these stud dogs could not line a greyhound

including magical dreams (ive not done his ped yet) and if so the offspring are unble to

register

same to this bitch and greyhound stud dog

all of them are 1st generation even there children cant (w00t)the 1st from the progeny

 

[milly]

OK HERE GOES IVE JUST BEEN TOLD THAT THE PROPOSER OF THIS HAS NOT BEEN IN THE GAME LONG TRUE OR NOT I DONT KNOW BUT IT IS QUITE A COMPLEX ISSUE TO BE PUT FORWARD BY SOMEONE NEW TO RACING OR IS THERE A X-FILES GOING HERE SOMEONE WHO ANIT GOT THE BALLS TO LOAD THE GUN BUT GET ANOTHER TO FIRE IT

If Marie and Chris hadn't proposed it, then I would have, and I'll let the seconder reply them self.

Geoff

 

[wild whippies]

Just to add, I think it's unfair to ask Marie directly what can and cannot be bred with regards to individual dogs. It's not rocket science, if either the dog, it's parents or it's grand parents are greyhounds then it cannot line a greyhound. Direct owners questions relating to their dogs should go through the correct procedure and seek advice from the BWRA although the owners should know themselves the answer.

 

[wild whippies]

OK HERE GOES IVE JUST BEEN TOLD THAT THE PROPOSER OF THIS HAS NOT BEEN IN THE GAME LONG TRUE OR NOT I DONT KNOW BUT IT IS QUITE A COMPLEX ISSUE TO BE PUT FORWARD BY SOMEONE NEW TO RACING OR IS THERE A X-FILES GOING HERE SOMEONE WHO ANIT GOT THE BALLS TO LOAD THE GUN BUT GET ANOTHER TO FIRE IT

If Marie and Chris hadn't proposed it, then I would have, and I'll let the seconder reply them self.

Geoff

There was LOTS of proposals regarding scratch dogs, all with the same agenda.

Just because someone's been in a sport for donkeys years doesn't mean they've learnt anything along the way.

 

[marielou]

OK HERE GOES IVE JUST BEEN TOLD THAT THE PROPOSER OF THIS HAS NOT BEEN IN THE GAME LONG TRUE OR NOT I DONT KNOW BUT IT IS QUITE A COMPLEX ISSUE TO BE PUT FORWARD BY SOMEONE NEW TO RACING OR IS THERE A X-FILES GOING HERE SOMEONE WHO ANIT GOT THE BALLS TO LOAD THE GUN BUT GET ANOTHER TO FIRE IT

Mr Warren my name is Marie Mottram and can I just say that I have no idea who you are either but as you seen concerned about who I am and what my motives are I'll gladly answer you although as nobody seems to be taking a lot of notice to the listening part of this typed debate Im probably wasting my time. Your informant is quite correct I am as people so quaintly say a newcomer. My grandfather trained racing greyhounds in the SE which is where I originally come from, however most of my family when I was growing up bred and trained dogs for the gun, when I left home I went into sighthounds which I have actively been involved in as an adult for the past 30yrs although its not polite to ask a ladies age you can find it on my profile :lol:

As for where this proposal came from, regular contributors to K9 will remember a topic before proposals were due to go in about scratch racing ( I currently only race scratch dogs) If you go back Im sure you'll find it or some of your friends will find it for you and in this discussion it became abundantly obvious that proposals were going to go in to curb both the size and outcrossing to greyhounds so Chris and I came up with this proposal hoping that it would be adopted as being better than some of the more severe proposals which were being suggested. It may have been 2 relative newcomers to whippet racing that proposed it but a respectable majority of very experienced whippet racers voted for it. Just for the record no one pulls my strings.

kind regards Marie

 

[Paws123]

Just to add, I think it's unfair to ask Marie directly what can and cannot be bred with regards to individual dogs. It's not rocket science, if either the dog, it's parents or it's grand parents are greyhounds then it cannot line a greyhound. Direct owners questions relating to their dogs should go through the correct procedure and seek advice from the BWRA although the owners should know themselves the answer.

I disagree after all Maire was the proposer and the writer of the proposal ... so how is it unfair to ask her regarding individual stud dogs ...esp if you want to line a bitch ...

after all theres not 33 pages of debate on here for nothing

Sorry Jac

All i asked is the above chart are right or wrong

 

[Trojan]

OK HERE GOES IVE JUST BEEN TOLD THAT THE PROPOSER OF THIS HAS NOT BEEN IN THE GAME LONG TRUE OR NOT I DONT KNOW BUT IT IS QUITE A COMPLEX ISSUE TO BE PUT FORWARD BY SOMEONE NEW TO RACING OR IS THERE A X-FILES GOING HERE SOMEONE WHO ANIT GOT THE BALLS TO LOAD THE GUN BUT GET ANOTHER TO FIRE IT

Don't see the relevance whether the proposer has been in racing 1 year or 40 years personally if a paid up member they are entitled to have an opinion, a vote or propose!!!!! If it was me who had put in the same proposal and have raced for a good few more years then i would say i would have got the same response

Sorry just my opinion

 

[marielou]

Just to add, I think it's unfair to ask Marie directly what can and cannot be bred with regards to individual dogs. It's not rocket science, if either the dog, it's parents or it's grand parents are greyhounds then it cannot line a greyhound. Direct owners questions relating to their dogs should go through the correct procedure and seek advice from the BWRA although the owners should know themselves the answer.

Thanks Jacs :thumbsup:

 

[wild whippies]

She is the proposer but why should she alone dictate to others if their future pups can or cannot run? We as a majority voted this in, the BWRA are our representative body and as such speak on our behalf through our instruction.

I feel it's verging on bullying to corner Marie in this manner.

 

[gary farmer]

Just to add, I think it's unfair to ask Marie directly what can and cannot be bred with regards to individual dogs. It's not rocket science, if either the dog, it's parents or it's grand parents are greyhounds then it cannot line a greyhound. Direct owners questions relating to their dogs should go through the correct procedure and seek advice from the BWRA although the owners should know themselves the answer.

I disagree after all Maire was the proposer and the writer of the proposal ... so how is it unfair to ask her regarding individual stud dogs ...esp if you want to line a bitch ...

after all theres not 33 pages of debate on here for nothing

Sorry Jac

All i asked is the above chart are right or wrong

WELL IF IM READING IT CORRECTLY DEE YOUR RIGHT

AND CHRIS THE PUPS FROM THEM CAN MATE A GREYHOUND

ANYONE FEEL FREE TO CORRECT ME IF IM WRONG BECAUSE THEY ARE 3RD GENARATION

GARY

 

[Paws123]

She is the proposer but why should she alone dictate to others if their future pups can or cannot run? We as a majority voted this in, the BWRA are our representative body and as such speak on our behalf through our instruction.I feel it's verging on bullying to corner Marie in this manner.

I don't mean to make it sound bullying but as i have said its the only way i can and others understand the proposal ...so if someone can apply a chart then it would be much appreciated

Dee

 

[tony warren]

ITS OK YOU CAN CALL ME TONY AND ILL SPEAK AS I FIND AND AS YOUR REPLY PLEASE DONT TRY TO TALK DOWN TO ME IVE BEEN ROUND DOGS MOST OF MY LIFE AND WAS INVOLVED IN THE WHIPPET RACING TILL ALL THE BACK BITING STARTED IM NOW RACING MY GREYHOUNDS AND STILL GOT CONCEARNS WITH SOME DOGS AND THERE BREEDING AND WHO IAM HERE GOES WAS CHAIRMAN OF THE SOUTH I AND RUN A FEW LURCHERS CLUBS TILL I SAW WHAT A GOOD THING THE NON PED GAME WAS SOCIAL SIDE AS WELL AND MET SOME REALY GOOD FREINDS AS WELL BUT IM ALLOWED TO ASK WHAT I WANT SO YOU GAVE ME WHAT YOU THINK IS RIGHT SO I LISTENED AND DONT AGREE .

MR TONY

 

[gary farmer]

ALSO I WOULD LIKE TO ADD THAT THIS PROPOSAL

WOULD EXCLUDE A SECOND GENARATION DOG SUCH AS TWO BECOME ONE 19LB FROM MATING A GREYHOUND

BUT WOULD ALLOW A DOG SUCH AS HELLBOUND TO LINE A GREYHOUND AND PRODUCE A DOG AS BIG AS MUSSELE BOUND 60LB PLUS

SO HOW IS THAT BREEDING DOWN

MAYBE THATS WHY YVONNE IS AGAINST THE 55LB CAP

GARY

 

[wild whippies]

I know you didn't Dee but I've got visions of Marie being approached by big burly men at the track sayings stuff like ''Oi are you saying I can't run my dog?!'' :blink:

I'll answer you though if it helps you to understand.

All the dogs pedigree's you have posted have a grand parent who is a greyhound - effectively making them 1/4 GHD. They cannot line a full greyhound under the new ruling, the strongest argument being that these pups would be 3/4 GHD. This means that the dogs could possess more greyhound genetic material than whippet.

They could line a 1/2 GHD though, but then the breeder would have to bear in mind the weight capping of 55lb could then come into play with the offspring.